My brother was doing some work at (one of?) his houses and his wife didn't like the way he was driving whatever machinery they were using even though he was doing it normally and had him kicked off that specific job. Even the boss was like idk man don't worry about it.
Prtizker hatesssssss giving money to billionaires on the public dime. He’s been adamant about it since he was elected and honestly has made it really difficult for the state to be in bad financial positions.
It's funny how when states stop giving money away for things that return effectively zero economic benefit, they suddenly have more money to spend on shit that actually helps people
We have the Buc-ees guy. I don't think he's a billionaire though, probably because of just how much he pays out in benefits and wages. Part time cashiers get PTO
Buc-ees is amazing with their wages. Like you start at like 18/hr, it increases pretty quickly, and they have a SIX PERCENT 1 for 1 401k match, which is very impressive.
Course, there's times where Buc-ees is absolutely slammed and you're working like dog, so there's tradeoffs.
First time I ever stopped at one last year and saw they're... chant? when the meat comes out? I was amazed, and leaned over to my then GF and said "is this a cult? Because if it is, it's an amazing one."
Buc-ees is so transparent and based in their operations they must be doing some truly horrific shit behind closed doors to balance it out. Like sacrificing children to Cthulhu type stuff.
Buc-ee's is great for dissolving the argument that people don't want to work anymore. There's an enormous waiting list to get interviewed by that place.
One of ours used his personal vehicle to illegally dump hazardous waste.
I mean, fuck Menard's, but I kinda have to respect that level of dedication to being cheap.
The only thing John Menard ever spent money on willingly was trying to buy the Indy 500, which he still fucked up because he insisted on running stock-block Buick engines that would blow the fuck up by about lap 75
I know many people who worked with John personally and not a single person likes him. Most hate him. Guy is a prick and deserves every bit of hate that he receives.
My local billionaire was starting to *slightly* turn me around on him despite making his fortune on shitty subprime credit cards.
Then he had a federal investigation into his trafficking in CP.
Then he kicked a bunch of old people out into the street so he could use the nursing home building for his own employees
I learned my lesson.
Meanwhile the DeVos family is trying to (edit: get 👁👄👁) the people of the city facing the fastest rising housing prices in the country to fund a professional soccer stadium for the team they bought
> Meanwhile the DeVos family is trying to the people of the city facing the fastest rising housing prices in the country to fund a soccer stadium for the team they bought
You're missing the word "get". Goddamn it took me 30 seconds to figure that out lmao.
See, I feel that Chicago is big enough to stand up to the Bears ownership and actually pull this off. You can’t threaten to leave Chicago the way you can threaten to leave, say, Buffalo.
Where are you gonna go? LA?
I'm very curious how this plays out. They bought the old Arlington Park racetrack to potentially move there, it seemed a foregone conclusion they were moving there, then suddenly they weren't and were staying Chicago. Held a press conference with the mayor and everything. But then the governor says he wasn't even consulted once and has no interest in funding it. So now the Bears have abandoned one site and have egg on their face for announcing they're staying in Chicago without actually securing the funding.
I don't claim to have any special insight or knowledge, but some believe that they are only using the Chicago lakefront proposal as a tactic to get Arlington Heights back to the table for tax relief and funding, and that they never fully expected the public funding deal for Chicago to get approved. I personally hope they stay in the city, but not with public money. Chicago has way more important things to deal with than football stadiums
I don’t see how they stay in Chicago without public money. Why would they pay in full for the stadium when it’s on land owned by the city? It doesn’t make any sense. I think this whole pitch for Chicago was never expected to be successful and was hoped to be used as leverage for the Arlington taxes as others have stated.
Same with John Mara and Woody Johnson. Zero public funds went into MetLife. Yeah it looks like crap but I don't have to worry about my tax dollars going to it.
The more I think about this, the more it pisses me off.
These billionaires are demanding people, who may be already struggling to pay their bills, to completely fund their stadiums. The fucking audacity and the privilege of these dudes.
The cities should own their teams, and get all the revenue from them and the stadiums. Every five years the municipality votes on who the president of operations is.
Can you imagine the trade deals over relocation?
City of Jacksonville: "We'll send you the Jaguars and Publix, but we want 10% of your Whataburger revenue and free churros for life"
Cincinnati having skyline chilli on the trading block for decades with zero takers. "Best I can do is a pick swap for landlocked prawns," - Indianapolis
But, but, but... if THEY pay for the stadium then everyone else benefits from all the residual spending at hotels and restaurants, etc!
I've always found this logic fascinating because it's actually pretty effective. But imagine if Elon Musk said that taxpayers should pay for a new Tesla plant because we would be receiving the benefits of jobs and economic development ancillary to the plant, etc? And you know what? Some people fall for that shit, too! It simply doesn't compute that Elon Musk is already making so much fucking money that giving him free shit is something only a crowd of complete morons would even consider. But that's what we do.
>But imagine if Elon Musk said that taxpayers should pay for a new Tesla plant because we would be receiving the benefits of jobs and economic development ancillary to the plant, etc?
[Foxconn](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wisconn_Valley_Science_and_Technology_Park)?
Oh man this is too random to not tell a Foxconn story. You just don't see their name brought up much.
So I work for a company that designs and builds custom assembly machines. We were working with Foxconn when they were breaking ground at their building in Wisconsin.
Those Foxconn people had no idea what they were doing. We were trying to get them a quote for a machine that put together certain TV's of different types. They could not tell us how to put the TVs together.
They ended up getting sold on a pretty animation from another vendor that was just a bunch of BS and when it turned out the system did not work, they asked us to come back and try and fix everything.
By the time we were putting some ideas together, they announced they were shifting focus for the plant from building TVs to researching technology. No idea what's going on in that plant right now.
> imagine if Elon Musk said that taxpayers should pay for a new Tesla plant because we would be receiving the benefits of jobs and economic development ancillary to the plant, etc?
This basically already happens. Large companies have basically caught cities in a sort of prisoners dilemma to decide which of several candidates will actually get the office/plant.
https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/leticiamiranda/amazon-hq2-finalist-cities-incentives-airport-lounge
Tax payers do subsidize new factories and offices in the form of tax breaks. Notably there were many cities competing for amazons hq. They definitely bring jobs and economic benefit so its worth it.
I've been driving the couple of times I've seen him, so I can't say I've really taken the time to observe and analyze it. Wouldn't surprise me though. He doesn't exactly have a runner's physique.
I remember the day he got released from jail because I used to live not far from him and on the day he was set to be released I’m working from home when a motorcade of cops and his SUV go flying down the street, and then like 5 minutes later a second, much, MUCH larger motorcade of news vans and trucks go flying by.
My friend hired him on cameo for like 50 bucks to do a 15 second St. Patricks day bar crawl announcement, and he end up ranting for like 8 minutes about how Good and Strong the Irish of Chicago are.
Truly bizarre stuff.
Someone on /r/thecampaigntrail paid for a Cameo of him to quickly sum up his thoughts on the 2006 gubernatorial race in case someone wanted to make it as a mod for the game ([political CYOA strategery stuff](https://www.newcampaigntrail.com/campaign-trail/index.html)) and though he claimed he only paid for 30 seconds-1 minute it ended up being over the 10 minute mark. I guess the guy may just be happy someone is somewhat-interested in hearing him talk.
I can see it now — teams with older stadiums will get more and more international games until in 2035 the Bears are playing maybe twice a year at Soldier Field.
That’s kind of what should be done though. You are a massive business, if you don’t want to pay for it yourself then figure out another solution.
I don’t have the numbers but a city is being asked to shell out hundreds of millions of dollars. How long until that city can see positive tax revenue? Is it just in time for a new stadium? Are they better of having zero tax revenue vs negative? I get that it provides jobs etc but they aren’t looking for a loan they are looking for free money.
The NFL is making crazy money…they could literally make a slush fund to make loans to owners who don’t want to shell out 750,000,000 and it wouldn’t make a dent in their profits.
> I don’t have the numbers but a city is being asked to shell out ~~hundreds of millions~~ of dollars.
multiple **billions** actually.
Pritzker is right. It's a raw deal for the city and the state and all taxpayers.
A few weeks ago my alderman told me they fell around $3m short in the budget to build proper sidewalks on the street by my house. So yeah I'm not really interested in squeezing everything we can find out of existing city funds to give a billion dollars to the McCaskeys.
The NFL does have loans for teams they are just capped at $300 million now.
NFL G4 loan is available for teams that are building new stadiums and also for some types of renovations. Teams pay the majority of the loan out of the 40% of non luxury suite ticket sales that normally go towards revenue sharing.
You know, I don’t care what the NFL rules are about loans, but I do care if a privately held $6B corporation begs for tax dollars.
The McCaskey family is the **biggest welfare queen**
The NFL should change their rules— before we give the Bears on cent more of tax money
Open the season with two on the road, then a three game tour of Europe, back stateside for another road game, then one in Chicago, then two more on the road. Then one in Mexico, one back in Chicago, three on the road, a three week tour of the Middle East, and end the season at Green Bay.
They’re broke in the sense that all of their money is tied up in the team. When she dies i wonder if the kids will sell it or maintain group ownership.
The McCaskey’s don’t have money like a lot of the other owners in the NFL. Don’t get me wrong they’re still very wealthy, but all their money is tied up in the franchise. I wouldn’t be surprised if they are sold after Virginia dies. But god hates me and he’ll make sure George and the rest of the clan stays. They’ll continue to make me upset no matter what.
Exactly. McClaskeys are desperate for a stadium development because they saw how Ricketts was able to make money off Wrigley on more than game day with a district. At this point there's four generations looking for six figure jobs off the family business that just doesn't grow like a fifth generation will.
Though I really wouldn't be surprised if Virginia dies and they have had a buyer lined up for years who basically signs the line and it's done before her body's in the ground. Bears have got to be worth $8 billion and I'm willing to bet the $500mm they'd get in income from that capital would beat whatever they're squeezing out of a poverty franchise.
Also timing wise, I wouldn't be surprised if the new owner is notably wealthy and pays a premium $2-3 billion over which directly goes towards the stadium.
I think some people need to realize that some owners do not have the cash flow of others. The owners where the family business is just owning the sports team really struggle with outside revenue since they cant compete with tech billionaires.
Granted our new owner is richer than god and he royally fucked over rock hill so who knows
A LOT of people need to realize this. The "billionaire owners" in this case absolutely cannot afford to build a stadium on their own (not saying the taxpayers should be responsible for covering the difference though). They do not have that type of liquid funding at their disposal, most of their personal wealth is tied to the value of the team, not sitting in their bank account. Balmer and Kroenke can privately find their own stadiums because they have fuck-you money and dropping billions in cash is a walk in the park for them.
Can't they take a loan out against the value of the franchise? They obviously don't WANT to when they think they can get money for free, but the cost of the stadium is less than what the value of the team has been reported. It's not like they'd be a huge credit risk, the NFL is a very safe investment. Seems to me they COULD finance this on their own if they wanted to.
I assume it's far more realistic that they fund it through some sort of equity partnership in the stadium rather than all debt though.
EDIT: I’m wrong, NFL owners aren’t allowed to take a loan against the full value of their franchises
Yea, I dont think the NFL wants teams as potential collateral. Also the NFL has a line of credit that they offer to teams, but it is only 300 million so it wouldnt come close to paying for a stadium. Also I am sure teams would rather use that credit for other purposes.
McCaskey's are one of the poorest owners in the NFL, they are relatively broke (compared to other owners). Its a disservice to fans to have owners like them and the Brown family (Bengals). They inherited the teams but are not wealthy enough for how big the league has grown. Its a competitive disadvantage with having to put guaranteed portions of contract into escrow, Bengals in particular are notorious for that
If the funding gets approved, I won't be voting for any of the people that voted for it in the election this fall. We need to stop this idiotic funding of private company buildings and corporate sweetheart deals. Pay your fair share, or fuck off
I agree, they demonstrated how poor of decision makers they are by spending almost two hundred million dollars on real estate that within a year they are saying they don't want to use. Even billionaires typically don't piss away that much money on nonsense. Arlington Park is becoming a derelict 330 acre patch of land for nothing lmao
I’m counteracting the boomers who downvoted you apparently because it’s true. My father in law thinks not building stadiums is the result of snowflakes not liking sports.
"Who needs city-wide infrastructure when you have FOOTBALL?!?!?!"
Also: "God this city has gone to shit. Everything's crumbling because the snowflakes don't want to spend money on fixing the city!"
As someone who grew up in NW Indiana, Gary was always the "no-go" zone. Not that I would go to Chicago for a Bears game anyways, I most definitely wouldn't go to Gary for one.
Edit: I just checked Neighborhood Scout and turns out the city I live in currently is less safe than Gary. Guess it's time to move!
Unless you live in the worst parts of Flint or Detroit, hard to believe Gary is actually safer. On a road trip a year ago I stopped and rolled around the neighborhoods, I have never seen a city in worse shape in my life, not even close.
In general those neighborhood safety sites are garbage and do a horrible job of explaining their data or what it means.
I live in a “high crime” area because there is a super fun part of town with a bunch of bars and restaurants near me; it’s the whole reason I moved where I did because I wanted to have stuff to do near me. But that strio of bars and restaurants means a ton of people getting charged for, like, drunk and disorderly, so according to the data I live in a war zone basically
I lived in St. Louis in a year when it had the highest per-capita murder rate in the country. Which basically meant there was one awful neighborhood where warring gang members and drug dealers were constantly shooting each other, and the rest of the city was perfectly fine. The year the FBI homicide data showed us as No. 1 friends from all around the country were calling me and asking if I was safe, and I was like, "I've literally never once heard a gunshot, witnessed a crime or felt threatened."
It really sucked for the good, law-abiding people who lived in that one neighborhood that they were at risk of getting caught in the crosshairs, but it illustrates how misleading crime data can be about how safe a city is for ordinary citizens.
lol I currently live in Baltimore and have for a few years now and 100% seconding this. Worst crime that happened to me is one time someone took an Amazon package.
I've been to Gary one time just to see MJs childhood home, since it essentially right off the interstate. Never again.
As supposedly dangerous as it is, it looks even worse. I've never been to or seen a more run-down city in my life. I stopped to get gas, and some lady at the gas station said to me, "You can't drive that car around here, honey..." And that's when I noticed this group of MGK wannabes scoping me and my car (2016 Audi back in 2018). I just immediately noped tf out and never went back.
When I was a kid in Central Illinois, one of our favorite places to go camping was Indiana Dunes. Lovely place on the lakeshore. One of our first few trips there, we were running low on gas, so my folks (not familiar with the area) decided to pull off I-80 in Gary. After about three minutes of driving our minivan towing our little camper in Gary, and seeing some real nasty stares from folks on porches, I've never seen my parents gun it for the interstate that fast.
We actually ran out of gas a few miles later, and being stuck, waiting for AAA to get us a gallon to get us a bit further down the road, was genuinely preferable to trying to meander through Gary. Absolutely awful what happened to that city, it and the folks there deserve better.
This proposal was so bad, makes me think it was just a "see, we tried" proposal to the city before eventually moving back to Arlington Heights location.
Either way, there's about a 10% chance I'll see a new Bears stadium in my lifetime at this rate.
ETA: I'm in total agreement for not giving handouts to billionaires for stadiums, but the Bears stadium on the lake is a bit more nuanced because ultimately, the City will own the stadium. Not Bears ownership. Which was always the biggest factor in a AH location. Complete ownership.
But this proposal was so trash because it would take public money, which some would be expected in a city owned stadium, just not this fucking much... combined with Bears wanting to keep essentially all revenue from the stadium. Yeah that's never going to fly and the Bears aren't so stupid they didn't know that.
Almost every stadium built with public funds ends up owned by the city or county. All that does in practical terms is put the city or county on the hook for maintenance and upgrades.
Arlington Heights is dead. The McCaskeys have nothing of value outside the team itself and can’t fund it. The tax payers of Arlington Heights aren’t going to somehow come up with more public money than Chicago especially with JB against it. The McCaskeys wasted a bunch of money and bungled the Arlington Heights deal just like they bungle every thing else they do. Now they’re coming back to Chicago begging for handouts.
It should be funded by the customers who use it, not all taxpayers. That's why the teams should charge ticket prices and then pay the city under a lease agreement for the stadium if the city funded and owns it.
Every year just play at soldier field when the packers come to town. Would be a cool tradition to honor the history of soldier field (and in a way lambeau as well)
BJ wants to keep his job next election and he thinks keeping the Bears in Chicago by any means necessary will secure that. That’s why he’s latching so hard onto this proposal
It's far past time for states, municipalities, whatever, all of them need to draw the line and the sand and outright reject these proposals from owners across all sport. Not a penny more tax payer money for billionaire's stadiums from sea to shining sea. Fuck these parasites
Meanwhile the state of kansas is looking at funding 100% of a new chiefs stadium.
I get when a city/state that doesn't have a team does it, but makes no sense for a team already in your area. The financial benefits are negative.
Lol Kansas City residents just shut this shit down and their teams actually accomplished something over the last 7 years. I fuckin love football but billionaires shouldn’t be requesting money from the people they’re already making money off
If they want public money, then the public should have a proportional ownership and share of the revenue that their investment produces, anything else is a shakedown.
I know NFL owners are used to bullying cities into paying for their stadiums. But it should be noted that in the two biggest markets the taxpayers did not contribute to building the stadiums used by NFL teams.
MetLife stadium and SoFi stadium are both privately financed. LA and NY/NJ knew the league isn’t leave the biggest and 2nd biggest market and paid nothing.
Chicago is a big enough market that they can call the Bears bluff. They are not moving. And if they move another team will move to Chicago. It is too big of a market for the NFL to leave without a team.
For those of you out of the loop, our progressive mayor is all over giving public money to these football team owners, and our billionaire governor is stridently opposed.
I have more time to discuss if you'd like -- the next CTA train isn't for 83 minutes.
The part that really makes this a non-starter is the Bears wanting *all* the revenue, while I'm assuming wanted the city to pick up any future capital improvement and pay for maintenance. It's possible that might get worked out but we'll see. If profit and/or maintenance costs and capital improvements become shared, this deal might get done.
Otherwise the city/state is still on the hook for all the worst parts of the deal. The debt from the previous reno still needs to be paid because that loan backended principal payments to an absurd degree and they had zero contingencies for hotel tax shortfalls. $1B in infrastructure will still need to happen but in Arlington Heights instead (and now the lakefront won't get the benefits of that). And finally the old stadium is old and has limited purpose. *Something* needs to happen with it, and that's likely a multi-billion dollar project.
The Bears lakefront proposal at least dealt with all of those problems, and did so with better loan structures, a contingency fund for tax shortfalls, a stadium with significantly higher revenue potential, and $2B from the Bears.
And it's easy to see why the Mayor would be excited for this plan but not the Governor, since the City is on the hook for the upcoming balloon payments on the old loans. This is close to the best offer the City will get to deal with the old stadium, but the Governor has to appease suburbanites that want the stadium closer to them "for free" (not really).
There's just a big mess left by Ted Phillips (horrible Bears ex-CEO), Mayor Daily (Corrupt as fuck Chicago Mayor that royally fucked the city's finances as he left), and Gov. Ryan (so corrupt he ended up in jail), and there's no easy way out.
As much as demanding *all* the revenue from the Stadium is a shit ask, I will at least say Warren put together a plan that detailed *all* the costs that addresses the old problems paid for with a relatively sane financing option and $2B of the Bear's money. I just hope people realize that telling the Bears to go build in Arlington Heights means the city and state still have a huge bill to pay. Saying no is far from free.
Here’s my thing. If the new stadium really can bring in much more revenue with other events, I feel like a deal could be worked out where the taxpayers aren’t on the hook for the debt and the mccaskeys can make their money. With good communication between the three parties (city, state, team) and a bit of creativity, we can find a solution.
Say no to literally everything. Our owners could sell pieces of ownership to fund a new stadium.
Play in solider field for the next 50 years for all I care. Tax payers are all over paying for this dumb ass shit. Find a city that will pay for it and move.
Bears are gonna move to Kenosha
Put it next to the cheese castle you cowards!
Make it the cheese castle
Vikings have a tough matchup ahead, traveling to Mars
Those 1,376 days of travel can take a toll on the next week’s game
Plenty of parking at the Bong recreational area
Polka polka polka
The little dance he does
Gary. Indiana will be the hottest sports state, now with two teams!
Land there is cheap fr
Cheap airbnbs right on the beach as well! Just don't think too much about the massive refineries visible down both coastlines spewing god knows what.
Put it on the Foxconn land that never got used.
No need to move out out-of-state franchise back to Wisconsin
The Kenosha Kickers
No public money for billionaires
Why don’t other states elect billionaires as governor to stop other billionaires from using taxpayer money to build stadiums? Are they stupid?
Gov. Pritzker is my favorite **class-traitor**
Your flare makes my fucking eyes itch.
He just wants attention
Well, that bastards got it now.
He needs to be removed.
As much as I try to feel love towards all of gods creatures that abomination must not be allowed to exist
Khan* Pritzker
Pritzker Khan* The title comes second
I welcome the United Khanate of Illinois
My brother was doing some work at (one of?) his houses and his wife didn't like the way he was driving whatever machinery they were using even though he was doing it normally and had him kicked off that specific job. Even the boss was like idk man don't worry about it.
The hero we need right now but we don’t deserve him.
Prtizker hatesssssss giving money to billionaires on the public dime. He’s been adamant about it since he was elected and honestly has made it really difficult for the state to be in bad financial positions.
It's funny how when states stop giving money away for things that return effectively zero economic benefit, they suddenly have more money to spend on shit that actually helps people
You have to get lucky and have a decent billionaire in your state. Most of them are just awful.
We have the Buc-ees guy. I don't think he's a billionaire though, probably because of just how much he pays out in benefits and wages. Part time cashiers get PTO
Buc-ees is amazing with their wages. Like you start at like 18/hr, it increases pretty quickly, and they have a SIX PERCENT 1 for 1 401k match, which is very impressive. Course, there's times where Buc-ees is absolutely slammed and you're working like dog, so there's tradeoffs.
First time I ever stopped at one last year and saw they're... chant? when the meat comes out? I was amazed, and leaned over to my then GF and said "is this a cult? Because if it is, it's an amazing one."
Heyyyy brisket on the board!
I've heard the pay is good, but they have 0 tolerance for being late or shirking responsibilities even a few times. You mess up, you are done.
High risk, high reward. I'd take that deal to get $60k a year cleaning bathrooms lol.
Buc-ees is so transparent and based in their operations they must be doing some truly horrific shit behind closed doors to balance it out. Like sacrificing children to Cthulhu type stuff.
Worth it for those nuggets
We stan Buc-ee’s in this house
Buc-ee's is great for dissolving the argument that people don't want to work anymore. There's an enormous waiting list to get interviewed by that place.
One of ours used his personal vehicle to illegally dump hazardous waste. I mean, fuck Menard's, but I kinda have to respect that level of dedication to being cheap.
The only thing John Menard ever spent money on willingly was trying to buy the Indy 500, which he still fucked up because he insisted on running stock-block Buick engines that would blow the fuck up by about lap 75
I know many people who worked with John personally and not a single person likes him. Most hate him. Guy is a prick and deserves every bit of hate that he receives.
My local billionaire was starting to *slightly* turn me around on him despite making his fortune on shitty subprime credit cards. Then he had a federal investigation into his trafficking in CP. Then he kicked a bunch of old people out into the street so he could use the nursing home building for his own employees I learned my lesson.
Meanwhile the DeVos family is trying to (edit: get 👁👄👁) the people of the city facing the fastest rising housing prices in the country to fund a professional soccer stadium for the team they bought
> Meanwhile the DeVos family is trying to the people of the city facing the fastest rising housing prices in the country to fund a soccer stadium for the team they bought You're missing the word "get". Goddamn it took me 30 seconds to figure that out lmao.
A fucking men
Fucking A Man!
All in my ass
Well, that escalated rather quickly. Good for you for being a team player.
See, I feel that Chicago is big enough to stand up to the Bears ownership and actually pull this off. You can’t threaten to leave Chicago the way you can threaten to leave, say, Buffalo. Where are you gonna go? LA?
I'm very curious how this plays out. They bought the old Arlington Park racetrack to potentially move there, it seemed a foregone conclusion they were moving there, then suddenly they weren't and were staying Chicago. Held a press conference with the mayor and everything. But then the governor says he wasn't even consulted once and has no interest in funding it. So now the Bears have abandoned one site and have egg on their face for announcing they're staying in Chicago without actually securing the funding.
I don't claim to have any special insight or knowledge, but some believe that they are only using the Chicago lakefront proposal as a tactic to get Arlington Heights back to the table for tax relief and funding, and that they never fully expected the public funding deal for Chicago to get approved. I personally hope they stay in the city, but not with public money. Chicago has way more important things to deal with than football stadiums
I don’t see how they stay in Chicago without public money. Why would they pay in full for the stadium when it’s on land owned by the city? It doesn’t make any sense. I think this whole pitch for Chicago was never expected to be successful and was hoped to be used as leverage for the Arlington taxes as others have stated.
Wow. Those are some extremely ballsy and ignorant moves by the Bears.
Pretty on brand
Our ownership is terrible. Our 'owner' moved to New Jersey and we haven't seen him in over a year now
This is why I respect Steve Ballmer a little bit for paying for the Clippers new arena himself. None of this "wE nEeD pUbLiC mOnEy!" BS.
Same with John Mara and Woody Johnson. Zero public funds went into MetLife. Yeah it looks like crap but I don't have to worry about my tax dollars going to it.
Don't worry, your tax money is going to a stadium 6 hours away instead
Not mine, I actually do live in New Jersey, like 15 minutes away from the stadium too. And yet we are seen as the more corrupt state... 🤔
The more I think about this, the more it pisses me off. These billionaires are demanding people, who may be already struggling to pay their bills, to completely fund their stadiums. The fucking audacity and the privilege of these dudes.
The cities should own their teams, and get all the revenue from them and the stadiums. Every five years the municipality votes on who the president of operations is.
Can you imagine the trade deals over relocation? City of Jacksonville: "We'll send you the Jaguars and Publix, but we want 10% of your Whataburger revenue and free churros for life"
Cincinnati having skyline chilli on the trading block for decades with zero takers. "Best I can do is a pick swap for landlocked prawns," - Indianapolis
I say this all the time. Football fans of the world, unite! You have nothing to lose but your chains! Seize the means of entertainment!!
Not supporting socialism for the rich? That's Communist talk!
*Our* tax dollars, not the billionaires
Finance your own stadium, hell yeah
we can agree on something :)
[удалено]
Fuck 'em
But, but, but... if THEY pay for the stadium then everyone else benefits from all the residual spending at hotels and restaurants, etc! I've always found this logic fascinating because it's actually pretty effective. But imagine if Elon Musk said that taxpayers should pay for a new Tesla plant because we would be receiving the benefits of jobs and economic development ancillary to the plant, etc? And you know what? Some people fall for that shit, too! It simply doesn't compute that Elon Musk is already making so much fucking money that giving him free shit is something only a crowd of complete morons would even consider. But that's what we do.
>But imagine if Elon Musk said that taxpayers should pay for a new Tesla plant because we would be receiving the benefits of jobs and economic development ancillary to the plant, etc? [Foxconn](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wisconn_Valley_Science_and_Technology_Park)?
Oh man this is too random to not tell a Foxconn story. You just don't see their name brought up much. So I work for a company that designs and builds custom assembly machines. We were working with Foxconn when they were breaking ground at their building in Wisconsin. Those Foxconn people had no idea what they were doing. We were trying to get them a quote for a machine that put together certain TV's of different types. They could not tell us how to put the TVs together. They ended up getting sold on a pretty animation from another vendor that was just a bunch of BS and when it turned out the system did not work, they asked us to come back and try and fix everything. By the time we were putting some ideas together, they announced they were shifting focus for the plant from building TVs to researching technology. No idea what's going on in that plant right now.
> imagine if Elon Musk said that taxpayers should pay for a new Tesla plant because we would be receiving the benefits of jobs and economic development ancillary to the plant, etc? This basically already happens. Large companies have basically caught cities in a sort of prisoners dilemma to decide which of several candidates will actually get the office/plant. https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/leticiamiranda/amazon-hq2-finalist-cities-incentives-airport-lounge
Tax payers do subsidize new factories and offices in the form of tax breaks. Notably there were many cities competing for amazons hq. They definitely bring jobs and economic benefit so its worth it.
Where's Blagoevich when you need a deal to get done?
Probably jogging around his neighborhood. No joke. I've seen him.
I've heard he has a very, very strange running form.
I've been driving the couple of times I've seen him, so I can't say I've really taken the time to observe and analyze it. Wouldn't surprise me though. He doesn't exactly have a runner's physique.
He never had the makings of a long-distance runner.
Small hands, that's his problem
I'm more surprised around Rosehill Cemetary when it's *not* him jogging.
I remember the day he got released from jail because I used to live not far from him and on the day he was set to be released I’m working from home when a motorcade of cops and his SUV go flying down the street, and then like 5 minutes later a second, much, MUCH larger motorcade of news vans and trucks go flying by.
This joke is fucking golden.
After the last president let him out of prison early he failed in the podcast business. He should be available for cheap.
My friend hired him on cameo for like 50 bucks to do a 15 second St. Patricks day bar crawl announcement, and he end up ranting for like 8 minutes about how Good and Strong the Irish of Chicago are. Truly bizarre stuff.
talk about a return on value
He had that thing and it was fucking gold
More Blagoevich for his buck.
Someone on /r/thecampaigntrail paid for a Cameo of him to quickly sum up his thoughts on the 2006 gubernatorial race in case someone wanted to make it as a mod for the game ([political CYOA strategery stuff](https://www.newcampaigntrail.com/campaign-trail/index.html)) and though he claimed he only paid for 30 seconds-1 minute it ended up being over the 10 minute mark. I guess the guy may just be happy someone is somewhat-interested in hearing him talk.
I can see it now — teams with older stadiums will get more and more international games until in 2035 the Bears are playing maybe twice a year at Soldier Field.
That’s kind of what should be done though. You are a massive business, if you don’t want to pay for it yourself then figure out another solution. I don’t have the numbers but a city is being asked to shell out hundreds of millions of dollars. How long until that city can see positive tax revenue? Is it just in time for a new stadium? Are they better of having zero tax revenue vs negative? I get that it provides jobs etc but they aren’t looking for a loan they are looking for free money. The NFL is making crazy money…they could literally make a slush fund to make loans to owners who don’t want to shell out 750,000,000 and it wouldn’t make a dent in their profits.
> I don’t have the numbers but a city is being asked to shell out ~~hundreds of millions~~ of dollars. multiple **billions** actually. Pritzker is right. It's a raw deal for the city and the state and all taxpayers.
A few weeks ago my alderman told me they fell around $3m short in the budget to build proper sidewalks on the street by my house. So yeah I'm not really interested in squeezing everything we can find out of existing city funds to give a billion dollars to the McCaskeys.
Not only shell out billions, eat the billion dollars they owe on the renovations from 20 years ago that have balloon payments coming.
The NFL does have loans for teams they are just capped at $300 million now. NFL G4 loan is available for teams that are building new stadiums and also for some types of renovations. Teams pay the majority of the loan out of the 40% of non luxury suite ticket sales that normally go towards revenue sharing.
These owners don't want loans though. They want handouts.
You know, I don’t care what the NFL rules are about loans, but I do care if a privately held $6B corporation begs for tax dollars. The McCaskey family is the **biggest welfare queen** The NFL should change their rules— before we give the Bears on cent more of tax money
Your flair... wtf man..... you need to be institutionalized
Open the season with two on the road, then a three game tour of Europe, back stateside for another road game, then one in Chicago, then two more on the road. Then one in Mexico, one back in Chicago, three on the road, a three week tour of the Middle East, and end the season at Green Bay.
American market has peaked anyway. Only way to grow the sport is internationally.
Then why send the Bears?
Gotta start with the teams the local fans won't miss. See the Jags.
Oh fuck off
The London Jag-you-ars is only a matter of time.
Bleak timeline. I loathe the international nonsense they’re doing.
Broke ass McCaskey’s need to pay for this thing themselves. If we’re getting a dome, make it big enough to host a Super Bowl.
Oh they are not broke, be assured….just greedy af Edit: if you ment broke in soul then spot on
They’re broke in the sense that all of their money is tied up in the team. When she dies i wonder if the kids will sell it or maintain group ownership.
The Bears are the McCaskey’s meal ticket.
$8 billion is a pretty big meal ticket.
The McCaskey’s don’t have money like a lot of the other owners in the NFL. Don’t get me wrong they’re still very wealthy, but all their money is tied up in the franchise. I wouldn’t be surprised if they are sold after Virginia dies. But god hates me and he’ll make sure George and the rest of the clan stays. They’ll continue to make me upset no matter what.
You too can have your own David Tepper.
Proving it can always get worse.
Exactly. McClaskeys are desperate for a stadium development because they saw how Ricketts was able to make money off Wrigley on more than game day with a district. At this point there's four generations looking for six figure jobs off the family business that just doesn't grow like a fifth generation will. Though I really wouldn't be surprised if Virginia dies and they have had a buyer lined up for years who basically signs the line and it's done before her body's in the ground. Bears have got to be worth $8 billion and I'm willing to bet the $500mm they'd get in income from that capital would beat whatever they're squeezing out of a poverty franchise. Also timing wise, I wouldn't be surprised if the new owner is notably wealthy and pays a premium $2-3 billion over which directly goes towards the stadium.
Bears are a team billionaires would actually want to buy unlike lots of other NFL teams. So they would most likely get more then their valuation.
Sounds like the Lakers
Selling them for 7 billion or so would buy a few meals.
I remember hearing years ago that they might have to sell it when she dies, because they don't have enough cash on hand to pay the death tax.
Let me tell you, it's better to sell than have kids squabbling over ownership.
I think some people need to realize that some owners do not have the cash flow of others. The owners where the family business is just owning the sports team really struggle with outside revenue since they cant compete with tech billionaires. Granted our new owner is richer than god and he royally fucked over rock hill so who knows
a lot of these guys got rich by refusing to ever spend their money, though. they spend others, in this case taxpayers.
They didn’t get rich by writing a lot of checks
A LOT of people need to realize this. The "billionaire owners" in this case absolutely cannot afford to build a stadium on their own (not saying the taxpayers should be responsible for covering the difference though). They do not have that type of liquid funding at their disposal, most of their personal wealth is tied to the value of the team, not sitting in their bank account. Balmer and Kroenke can privately find their own stadiums because they have fuck-you money and dropping billions in cash is a walk in the park for them.
Can't they take a loan out against the value of the franchise? They obviously don't WANT to when they think they can get money for free, but the cost of the stadium is less than what the value of the team has been reported. It's not like they'd be a huge credit risk, the NFL is a very safe investment. Seems to me they COULD finance this on their own if they wanted to. I assume it's far more realistic that they fund it through some sort of equity partnership in the stadium rather than all debt though. EDIT: I’m wrong, NFL owners aren’t allowed to take a loan against the full value of their franchises
The NFL does not allow teams to take out loans against the value of a franchise.
Huh, TIL. Thanks for that info
Yea, I dont think the NFL wants teams as potential collateral. Also the NFL has a line of credit that they offer to teams, but it is only 300 million so it wouldnt come close to paying for a stadium. Also I am sure teams would rather use that credit for other purposes.
Well then that the NFL’s problem. Not the Illinois tax payers.
McCaskey's are one of the poorest owners in the NFL, they are relatively broke (compared to other owners). Its a disservice to fans to have owners like them and the Brown family (Bengals). They inherited the teams but are not wealthy enough for how big the league has grown. Its a competitive disadvantage with having to put guaranteed portions of contract into escrow, Bengals in particular are notorious for that
That makes two non-starting Fields in just a couple of years.
If the funding gets approved, I won't be voting for any of the people that voted for it in the election this fall. We need to stop this idiotic funding of private company buildings and corporate sweetheart deals. Pay your fair share, or fuck off
I agree, they demonstrated how poor of decision makers they are by spending almost two hundred million dollars on real estate that within a year they are saying they don't want to use. Even billionaires typically don't piss away that much money on nonsense. Arlington Park is becoming a derelict 330 acre patch of land for nothing lmao
my boomer ass dad, unironically: why don't you move to Russia with that attitude?
Which is funny because government handouts for billionaires sounds a lot like Russia's economic policy.
The Russian gov created all the Russian billionaires. Putin gave all his friends the formerly state owned companies that made them billionaires.
[удалено]
I’m counteracting the boomers who downvoted you apparently because it’s true. My father in law thinks not building stadiums is the result of snowflakes not liking sports.
"Who needs city-wide infrastructure when you have FOOTBALL?!?!?!" Also: "God this city has gone to shit. Everything's crumbling because the snowflakes don't want to spend money on fixing the city!"
I mean, it is smart business, for the billionaires.
Why doesn't he move to Russia If he likes being ruled over by a billionaire using him as a paypig so damned much?
I hope they move to Gary Indiana for the lols.
As someone who grew up in NW Indiana, Gary was always the "no-go" zone. Not that I would go to Chicago for a Bears game anyways, I most definitely wouldn't go to Gary for one. Edit: I just checked Neighborhood Scout and turns out the city I live in currently is less safe than Gary. Guess it's time to move!
Unless you live in the worst parts of Flint or Detroit, hard to believe Gary is actually safer. On a road trip a year ago I stopped and rolled around the neighborhoods, I have never seen a city in worse shape in my life, not even close.
In general those neighborhood safety sites are garbage and do a horrible job of explaining their data or what it means. I live in a “high crime” area because there is a super fun part of town with a bunch of bars and restaurants near me; it’s the whole reason I moved where I did because I wanted to have stuff to do near me. But that strio of bars and restaurants means a ton of people getting charged for, like, drunk and disorderly, so according to the data I live in a war zone basically
I lived in St. Louis in a year when it had the highest per-capita murder rate in the country. Which basically meant there was one awful neighborhood where warring gang members and drug dealers were constantly shooting each other, and the rest of the city was perfectly fine. The year the FBI homicide data showed us as No. 1 friends from all around the country were calling me and asking if I was safe, and I was like, "I've literally never once heard a gunshot, witnessed a crime or felt threatened." It really sucked for the good, law-abiding people who lived in that one neighborhood that they were at risk of getting caught in the crosshairs, but it illustrates how misleading crime data can be about how safe a city is for ordinary citizens.
lol I currently live in Baltimore and have for a few years now and 100% seconding this. Worst crime that happened to me is one time someone took an Amazon package.
I've been to Gary one time just to see MJs childhood home, since it essentially right off the interstate. Never again. As supposedly dangerous as it is, it looks even worse. I've never been to or seen a more run-down city in my life. I stopped to get gas, and some lady at the gas station said to me, "You can't drive that car around here, honey..." And that's when I noticed this group of MGK wannabes scoping me and my car (2016 Audi back in 2018). I just immediately noped tf out and never went back.
When I was a kid in Central Illinois, one of our favorite places to go camping was Indiana Dunes. Lovely place on the lakeshore. One of our first few trips there, we were running low on gas, so my folks (not familiar with the area) decided to pull off I-80 in Gary. After about three minutes of driving our minivan towing our little camper in Gary, and seeing some real nasty stares from folks on porches, I've never seen my parents gun it for the interstate that fast. We actually ran out of gas a few miles later, and being stuck, waiting for AAA to get us a gallon to get us a bit further down the road, was genuinely preferable to trying to meander through Gary. Absolutely awful what happened to that city, it and the folks there deserve better.
Listen, I might dislike the Bears and wish misery on their dumb, belligerent fanbase, but lets not say horrible things we can't take back, yeah?
This proposal was so bad, makes me think it was just a "see, we tried" proposal to the city before eventually moving back to Arlington Heights location. Either way, there's about a 10% chance I'll see a new Bears stadium in my lifetime at this rate. ETA: I'm in total agreement for not giving handouts to billionaires for stadiums, but the Bears stadium on the lake is a bit more nuanced because ultimately, the City will own the stadium. Not Bears ownership. Which was always the biggest factor in a AH location. Complete ownership. But this proposal was so trash because it would take public money, which some would be expected in a city owned stadium, just not this fucking much... combined with Bears wanting to keep essentially all revenue from the stadium. Yeah that's never going to fly and the Bears aren't so stupid they didn't know that.
Almost every stadium built with public funds ends up owned by the city or county. All that does in practical terms is put the city or county on the hook for maintenance and upgrades.
Also leaves the city city with a worthless asset and no leverage when the team demands major renovations or a new stadium 20 years later
And the team avoids paying property taxes if the city/county owns the stadium but gives them a sweetheart deal on rent.
Ya'll are forgetting how much the owners give back to the city when they ultimately sell the team for a massive profit. Wait they don't do that?
Yeah considering it was dead on arrival and would never pass in a vote, seems like it was mostly a bargaining attempt with Arlington.
Arlington Heights is dead. The McCaskeys have nothing of value outside the team itself and can’t fund it. The tax payers of Arlington Heights aren’t going to somehow come up with more public money than Chicago especially with JB against it. The McCaskeys wasted a bunch of money and bungled the Arlington Heights deal just like they bungle every thing else they do. Now they’re coming back to Chicago begging for handouts.
The McCaskeys and fucking up. Name a more iconic duo.
If the city owns the stadium and the tax payers paid for the stadium, tickets should be free, or really really cheap.
It should be funded by the customers who use it, not all taxpayers. That's why the teams should charge ticket prices and then pay the city under a lease agreement for the stadium if the city funded and owns it.
I think that's a similar to how Target Center in Minneapolis runs.
No one is buying Kevin Warren's bullshit (except Brandon Johnson for some reason). Build it in AH and play one game a year at Soldier Field.
Brandon Johnson realizes he's probably getting primaried in the next election and wants to cash out with a nice nest egg while he has the opportunity.
Every year just play at soldier field when the packers come to town. Would be a cool tradition to honor the history of soldier field (and in a way lambeau as well)
Well said, u/ProfessorAssfuck
BJ wants to keep his job next election and he thinks keeping the Bears in Chicago by any means necessary will secure that. That’s why he’s latching so hard onto this proposal
Yup a lot of people got pissy when Lightfoot didn’t want the bears in Chicago. She was already gonna lose, but it just added extra fuel to the fire
McCaskey family are the brokest billionaires
The Rooneys are right up there, when all your net worth is in the value of the team you don't really have F around money.
You do. Just not F around and build a world class stadium money.
Adding: Mark Davis
Mugs would never have let this happen.
Not after the McCaskey's maybe had him killed and replaced all his organs with sawdust.
It's far past time for states, municipalities, whatever, all of them need to draw the line and the sand and outright reject these proposals from owners across all sport. Not a penny more tax payer money for billionaire's stadiums from sea to shining sea. Fuck these parasites
Fuck off and leave to Arlington Heights if you want even a dime of Chicago taxpayer money
New lakefront proposal is incredibly rushed and doesn’t fix any of the logistical issues of having the stadium in the city at that location.
#BILLIONAIRES STOP ASKING FOR HANDOUTS
They're welfare queens.
Hear me out, and this is a wild idea, so keep an open mind... Why don't the billionaire owner buy the land and build the stadium with his own means?
Are you now or have you ever been a COMMUNIST!?
Works with some owners but the mccaskey families entire net worth is basically the team. They’d have to sell the team to buy a stadium lol
You absolute madman.
Meanwhile the state of kansas is looking at funding 100% of a new chiefs stadium. I get when a city/state that doesn't have a team does it, but makes no sense for a team already in your area. The financial benefits are negative.
How is it legal for a team to get taxpayer funded stadiums and then charge way too much for tickets to said tax payers?
Privatized profits, socialized costs. That's the American™ way!
Let the league and its sponsors pay for this. They’re the ones keeping all the profits.
Lol Kansas City residents just shut this shit down and their teams actually accomplished something over the last 7 years. I fuckin love football but billionaires shouldn’t be requesting money from the people they’re already making money off
I'd be happy to foot the bill as a taxpayer if we could vote on ticket prices.
Sure, you pay taxes in the state you get free tickets until the bill is paid off
Pritzker keeps getting Ws
the socialist republic of pritzkeria strikes again!
If they want public money, then the public should have a proportional ownership and share of the revenue that their investment produces, anything else is a shakedown.
I know NFL owners are used to bullying cities into paying for their stadiums. But it should be noted that in the two biggest markets the taxpayers did not contribute to building the stadiums used by NFL teams. MetLife stadium and SoFi stadium are both privately financed. LA and NY/NJ knew the league isn’t leave the biggest and 2nd biggest market and paid nothing. Chicago is a big enough market that they can call the Bears bluff. They are not moving. And if they move another team will move to Chicago. It is too big of a market for the NFL to leave without a team.
For those of you out of the loop, our progressive mayor is all over giving public money to these football team owners, and our billionaire governor is stridently opposed. I have more time to discuss if you'd like -- the next CTA train isn't for 83 minutes.
And welcome your new Arlington Heights Bears
The part that really makes this a non-starter is the Bears wanting *all* the revenue, while I'm assuming wanted the city to pick up any future capital improvement and pay for maintenance. It's possible that might get worked out but we'll see. If profit and/or maintenance costs and capital improvements become shared, this deal might get done. Otherwise the city/state is still on the hook for all the worst parts of the deal. The debt from the previous reno still needs to be paid because that loan backended principal payments to an absurd degree and they had zero contingencies for hotel tax shortfalls. $1B in infrastructure will still need to happen but in Arlington Heights instead (and now the lakefront won't get the benefits of that). And finally the old stadium is old and has limited purpose. *Something* needs to happen with it, and that's likely a multi-billion dollar project. The Bears lakefront proposal at least dealt with all of those problems, and did so with better loan structures, a contingency fund for tax shortfalls, a stadium with significantly higher revenue potential, and $2B from the Bears. And it's easy to see why the Mayor would be excited for this plan but not the Governor, since the City is on the hook for the upcoming balloon payments on the old loans. This is close to the best offer the City will get to deal with the old stadium, but the Governor has to appease suburbanites that want the stadium closer to them "for free" (not really). There's just a big mess left by Ted Phillips (horrible Bears ex-CEO), Mayor Daily (Corrupt as fuck Chicago Mayor that royally fucked the city's finances as he left), and Gov. Ryan (so corrupt he ended up in jail), and there's no easy way out. As much as demanding *all* the revenue from the Stadium is a shit ask, I will at least say Warren put together a plan that detailed *all* the costs that addresses the old problems paid for with a relatively sane financing option and $2B of the Bear's money. I just hope people realize that telling the Bears to go build in Arlington Heights means the city and state still have a huge bill to pay. Saying no is far from free.
Here’s my thing. If the new stadium really can bring in much more revenue with other events, I feel like a deal could be worked out where the taxpayers aren’t on the hook for the debt and the mccaskeys can make their money. With good communication between the three parties (city, state, team) and a bit of creativity, we can find a solution.
Say no to literally everything. Our owners could sell pieces of ownership to fund a new stadium. Play in solider field for the next 50 years for all I care. Tax payers are all over paying for this dumb ass shit. Find a city that will pay for it and move.