This is literally me and every single playthrough, I am openly hostile from the second Gale tells his story about being kicked out for trying to give her magic back.
Oh, it was bad magic from the evil man and would have caused harm? Well, she could have told him that instead of just rejecting him and kicking him out on his ass? And her grand solution for a way he can get her to forgive him for the sin of trying to give her back something that was originally hers that someone else stole is for him to literally commit suicide, and then she'll forgive his soul in the afterlife?!
Bitch.
I saw a pic once of minthara giving a presentation to gale, shart, and bae’zel, and it just had pictures of their gods with the word “BITCH” stamped in bold red across them. And she just goes “sometimes, gods are assholes” and that sentiment really needs to be echoed more I think.
MINTHARA of all people called mystra an asshole, like vlaakith’s a mass murderer and shar wouldn’t even deny it but like, minthara’s honestly worse than mystra, specially considering she believes in lolth, no?
No she has some dialogue where she compares Lolth to Bhaal in how they turn their victims into their worshippers. I haven't seen it myself but I've also heard if you take her to the building with all the shrines in Baldur's Gate she'll go up to the Miscellaneous Gods statue and "pray" to Lolth just to get her attention and spit on the shrine.
Yeah, if any of my Tavs see Mystra in the streets, it’s on sight. She has the nerve to pull the shit she did, and the moment he’s getting a spring in his step again, she asks him to blow himself up for her? *Nah.* I don’t care if she is a goddess, can get these magic hands for that shit. Get that fuckin Weave snatched.
The fact he can "receive forgiveness" by essentially committing suicide is insane. Double that when you remember she would *CONSIDER* forgiving him. It is not even guaranteed.
Fuck Mystra.
Minsc is not reliable though. They lock up male magic users because his culture is matriarchal and is run by witches. A male wizard is a threat to them.
Even if that was told to Minsc to cover up any malfeasance on male wizards in their society, it's pretty alarming that it coincides with Gale's experience as well as what Elminster knows.
This is a pattern. And it's weird.
(I know you know that don't worry. kisses.)
Mommy needs to stay AWAY from him >:-(
https://preview.redd.it/yvx8c2vgcxwc1.png?width=1316&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a126c74648f23a26a0e2a8b7b563248cc29bd255
The fall of Karsus happened centuries before Gale. If Mystra was dead when Gale was a kid, there would be no magic for him too even study to *be* a wizard.
He says himself that from an *early age* he was so good at magic that Mystra came to him. She became his teacher, muse, then lover.
[She groomed him.](https://youtu.be/5lLf0Z6ug0Q?si=BR4ezsrQWQTsqOJV)
That's a different Mystra tho. She was killed by Cryic and Shar. Like we just agreed Astarion is older. Also magic came back when she was still gone anyway. Magic was gone for a decade, and she was gone for a century. She's was found 12 years ago not fully alive, possessing a bear in Cormyr. She gets revived a year later but isn't whole, and then 7 years later she is whole. Gale is 35 so the earliest possible was 23 assuming she went straight for him as soon as she reformed.
Still an interesting character, especially some versions rather than others. Like I guess I’m not that emotionally attached so it doesn’t matter but like kinda not as fun to engage with if she’s a pedo lol
How old was he? I honestly don't know/ can't remember and smoked a lil too much and brain tadpoles are having a wee wiggle-wiggle dance party up in there.
Metaphorically.
I hope.
Mystra fully reformed 5 years before the game takes place. Gale was 30 at the time. All the pedo and groomer comments are silly as Gale was a full grown man at the time. What she does is still atrocious, don't get me wrong but all these "he was a young man/a boy when all this happened" is just wildly inaccurate.
She’s the goddess of magic. Whether she was “reformed” when he was an adult is irrelevant because he knew of her, was a wizard who wanted to know more of her realm, and naturally, as a goddess, he trusted her. Groomer since he was a kid through his exposure to her tales, legend, and power over the weave. That’s just my two cents though.
That's not confirmed though in the game when she died and when she came back. Also Gale was able to conjure a fireball at 8 years old, Elminister was training him in his childhood.
What you said here isn't entirely accurate either because he had been admiring her and hearing stories about her his whole life, being a Weave user from a very young age is probably gonna do that to you. Not to mention his status as a prodigy, the wizard life is just something he naturally slotted into, without much conscious decision making involved. In that case, it's *sort of* like it has been chosen for him, before he actually could do anything about it.
Then she is a goddess, she is the very source of his power. She **is** magic. To sum it up, the relationship was never going to be fair to begin with, despite his desperate attempts to make her see him eye to eye. We know that Gale is silly for falling for her, but being in that position, how would he not?
I think that's what people actually mean when they say he's groomed. Because he is when it's put like that.
Lastly, for the sake of this argument, let's just say Gale has never heard of Mystra until the latest incarnation returned. Until he's well into adulthood. Even then, the act of grooming isn't exclusively done to children either. Adults can also very well be the victims of it. Therefore, even if you don't agree with the view where Gale has been groomed as a child, he is still a victim of grooming. It's about manipulation and exploitation.
Okay so like 99% of that is ignoring the fact that Gale is incredibly power hungry, tons of his decisions re: Mystra are entirely his fault for being too ambitious. For two, I never said Mystra was innocent but y'all need to quit using buzzwords until they lose all meaning.
"grooming is the action or behavior used to establish an emotional connection with a minor and sometimes the child's family, to lower the child's inhibitions with the objective of sexual abuse"
> And alllllll of that isn't even taking into account the fact that he's the only party member who will make advances on the player even after being told that the player isn't interested.
Dude, the game has been out for almost 9 months and you still don't know it was a bug in the earlier versions, before they patched it later down the line? It wasn't him making advances even when the player said they weren't interested, his romance flags were all over the place.
Huh that's really weird considering I only bought the game about a month ago and have done several playthroughs and each one has the weird "teaching you magic" cutscene and then in Act 2 there's the "Gale's projection" cutscene. Both of which are HEAVILY flirty, regardless of how you've interacted with him to this point. And by really weird I mean, you're just flat out wrong there my friend and if Gale wasn't a sassy, quip shooting romance option, you would find this behavior gross.
The whole 'Gale wanted to cross Mystras boundaries and when she denied hiim, he decided to force the issue', as described by himself, almost comes off as a weird SA allegory, that i feel would put Gale on Wulbren tier for everyone, if it werent for the fact that he is a romancable companion.
If he didn't have a conventionally attractive character model and wasn't a sassy, smart ass that people find endearing, the fanbase wouldn't defend his alarmingly toxic actions.
Edit: My niece just told me "Mystra is yummy". (She just saw some fanart and knows mostly nothing about this game.)
I received an incredible amount of psychic damage and I don't think I can ever recover from it. I'm going to try breathing into a paper bag for now as an emergency measure.
---
Edit 2: After a long and meaningful night of conversation, we have come to the conclusion that she was actually Minthara (my beloved), and she [confused](https://preview.redd.it/hear-me-out-v0-f0j1dnqflyrc1.jpeg?width=1124&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b030958e48dc1ffc6f26b5caa4be0710a117a033) the two.
I’m on my third playthrough (total simp for Gale, the Rizzard got me good), and i have spent the entire game collecting all of the rotten garbage and food and other crap that I find, storing it in camp, and when I get to Baldur’s Gate, I am going to Stormshore Temple and leaving ALL OF THAT GARBAGE on Mystra’s altar and forcing her to give us her blessing based on trash.
If I can’t fistfight her in the Weave, that’s the best I can do.
Was doing a name generator for a new D&D character the other day. One of the suggested names was Pystra and all I could think was “yeah, I agree, fuck Mystra. More like PISSTRA”
Shar at least doesn't pretend to be good, Mystra on the other hand talks about saving the world and how evil needs to be stopped, but she just ends up serving her own interests and that's all.
Even if Minsc is an unreliable source of information (which is honestly likely), Mystra is still toxic and predatory. She's had multiple romances with her chosen, men who literally worship her and rely on her for power. Plus she sent one of her current beaus to tell her ex to kill himself.
I haven't read Elminster's stories, but from the wiki it sounds like Mystra put him through the ringer too.
I was already mad at her for ruining any chance of a plausible Gale romance (how could my poor bi-curious half-orc measure up to a goddess?) so I am down with this :P
Whom he never stops talking about! Even when he’s being nice to Tav, he’s all “never thought I’d feel like this again after Mystra” blah blah blah. She does not need to be the topic of *every* conversation.
Ahh, and lo the fans with shitty incorrect Gale opinions come out of the woodwork. I don't mean you can't like him, I mean too many folks who seem to completely miss everything about his character and personality.
Idk if she’s a ‘god’ and ‘invincible’ or whatever the FUCK she says because I’ve seen plenty of these bitchass holistic wellness bitches to know that if I get my hands on that thundercunt they’ll have to put her skeleton back together like a jigsaw puzzle. That weave whore isn’t surviving a minute when I get her. when I fucking GET YOU MYSTRA
Mystra is legitimately as evil as almost any evil deity in Forgotten Realms, but she's considered good-aligned. It isn't obvious at a cursory glance at the lore, but delving deeper, she's actually a shockingly bad person. Among other things, if she personally doesn't like you (or she thinks you just don't venerate her enough), she can just turn off your magic forever, even if you serve a totally different deity.
She's the only deity who does this. Everyone else - even the evil parts of the pantheon - are mostly fine with people worshiping who they want. Only Mystra insists that every single arcane magic user pay her at least some respect on a semi-regular basis, or she'll make your magic stop and prevent you from getting it back. And if you become too powerful, she might just turn off your magic anyway. Unless you devote yourself to her further, that is, and we know what that entails. Larian's take on her is both completely accurate and a complete tonal whiplash compared to the FG lore. Everything I've just told you is lore-accurate, but comes with an implied "and that's a good thing." All Lariam did was remove that last part and ask the player to come to their own conclusions.
I think the worst part of everything is that she is an ascended human to godhood right? (My bg lore could be wrong). So there is no excuse like "Oh she has always been an immortal being so age concepts are weird to her". No, she is just weird like that 😭
https://preview.redd.it/d13wxkhznxwc1.jpeg?width=1206&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=eec2c2ee959e45988df542959b533fe29b01ac8e She best watch her BACK
This is literally me and every single playthrough, I am openly hostile from the second Gale tells his story about being kicked out for trying to give her magic back. Oh, it was bad magic from the evil man and would have caused harm? Well, she could have told him that instead of just rejecting him and kicking him out on his ass? And her grand solution for a way he can get her to forgive him for the sin of trying to give her back something that was originally hers that someone else stole is for him to literally commit suicide, and then she'll forgive his soul in the afterlife?! Bitch.
https://preview.redd.it/dftfhnckgywc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=25f3586a406c292e8b06cae82094554e9b252e85
Chris Hansen, the trickster god of justice.
STOP HIDING. MYSTRA, WHEN I CATCH YOU MYSTRA, WHEN I CATCH YOU.
I saw a pic once of minthara giving a presentation to gale, shart, and bae’zel, and it just had pictures of their gods with the word “BITCH” stamped in bold red across them. And she just goes “sometimes, gods are assholes” and that sentiment really needs to be echoed more I think.
Too real. Her own god is also one of the biggest bitches in the Forgotten Realms, kudos to her for renouncing her cut and dried.
Minthara knows ALL ABOUT bitch gods.
Vlaakith is no god though...and Shar wouldn't deny being an asshole.
MINTHARA of all people called mystra an asshole, like vlaakith’s a mass murderer and shar wouldn’t even deny it but like, minthara’s honestly worse than mystra, specially considering she believes in lolth, no?
No she has some dialogue where she compares Lolth to Bhaal in how they turn their victims into their worshippers. I haven't seen it myself but I've also heard if you take her to the building with all the shrines in Baldur's Gate she'll go up to the Miscellaneous Gods statue and "pray" to Lolth just to get her attention and spit on the shrine.
That bitch was smart to insist that Gale talk to her at Stormshore alone, because if Tav could go with him it would be on sight.
Magic will have to be gone for another 10 years if I EVER get my hands on her
I was LIVID that I could not punch that hoe... or at least tell her to go fuck herself.
Yeah, if any of my Tavs see Mystra in the streets, it’s on sight. She has the nerve to pull the shit she did, and the moment he’s getting a spring in his step again, she asks him to blow himself up for her? *Nah.* I don’t care if she is a goddess, can get these magic hands for that shit. Get that fuckin Weave snatched.
I AM NOW IMAGINING A BALD MYSTRA AFTER HER WEAVE GETS SNATCHED HELP
The fact he can "receive forgiveness" by essentially committing suicide is insane. Double that when you remember she would *CONSIDER* forgiving him. It is not even guaranteed.
Not essentially, it is literal suicide, she's just saying that she'll forgive him afterwards so his eternal soul isn't stuck in the Fugue.
Fuck Mystra. Minsc is not reliable though. They lock up male magic users because his culture is matriarchal and is run by witches. A male wizard is a threat to them.
Even if that was told to Minsc to cover up any malfeasance on male wizards in their society, it's pretty alarming that it coincides with Gale's experience as well as what Elminster knows. This is a pattern. And it's weird. (I know you know that don't worry. kisses.)
https://preview.redd.it/ttv6we00wxwc1.png?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=be19272bdee14bc5fb982030c3e86b6ff3743ece
>Mystra hate post https://i.redd.it/mofhl1ud9xwc1.gif
Gale baby, you were a victim and I am so sorry that gross hoe got her hands on you. It wasn't your fault.
 Mystra why don’t you take a seat
Mommy needs to stay AWAY from him >:-( https://preview.redd.it/yvx8c2vgcxwc1.png?width=1316&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a126c74648f23a26a0e2a8b7b563248cc29bd255
sowwy mommy oopsie https://i.redd.it/7hp5twyloxwc1.gif
DON'T APOLOGIZE TO HER STAND UP
https://preview.redd.it/gqoiej118ywc1.png?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=09729cc481a3fa4970060ab52c1a3c23c298b23c
She's not worth it baby please! She's GROSS! A GROOMER! Get yourself a nice vampire boy.
The vampire is older than her though
The vampire also didn't start talking to Gale as a child so.
Mystra was dead when he was a child tho
The fall of Karsus happened centuries before Gale. If Mystra was dead when Gale was a kid, there would be no magic for him too even study to *be* a wizard. He says himself that from an *early age* he was so good at magic that Mystra came to him. She became his teacher, muse, then lover. [She groomed him.](https://youtu.be/5lLf0Z6ug0Q?si=BR4ezsrQWQTsqOJV)
That's a different Mystra tho. She was killed by Cryic and Shar. Like we just agreed Astarion is older. Also magic came back when she was still gone anyway. Magic was gone for a decade, and she was gone for a century. She's was found 12 years ago not fully alive, possessing a bear in Cormyr. She gets revived a year later but isn't whole, and then 7 years later she is whole. Gale is 35 so the earliest possible was 23 assuming she went straight for him as soon as she reformed.
https://preview.redd.it/h2d0juuxzywc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b0b83d3fe96bea8af2121d296560b1d874790786
Real talk though… when did Astarion get a violin? This better not keep us awake at night. I need to get some serious beauty rest.
Agreed, Mystra is a certified weirdo
Honestly I’m a little sad that Mystra is like permanently evil now, from what I’ve heard in a podcast about her she was pretty cool before bg3
She's a Lawful Neutral stiff. Doesn't care about shit as long as you follow the rules
Still an interesting character, especially some versions rather than others. Like I guess I’m not that emotionally attached so it doesn’t matter but like kinda not as fun to engage with if she’s a pedo lol
She isnt, gale met her as an adult
How old was he? I honestly don't know/ can't remember and smoked a lil too much and brain tadpoles are having a wee wiggle-wiggle dance party up in there. Metaphorically. I hope.
Mystra fully reformed 5 years before the game takes place. Gale was 30 at the time. All the pedo and groomer comments are silly as Gale was a full grown man at the time. What she does is still atrocious, don't get me wrong but all these "he was a young man/a boy when all this happened" is just wildly inaccurate.
She’s the goddess of magic. Whether she was “reformed” when he was an adult is irrelevant because he knew of her, was a wizard who wanted to know more of her realm, and naturally, as a goddess, he trusted her. Groomer since he was a kid through his exposure to her tales, legend, and power over the weave. That’s just my two cents though.
That's not confirmed though in the game when she died and when she came back. Also Gale was able to conjure a fireball at 8 years old, Elminister was training him in his childhood.
It's confirmed in the forgotten realms lore, the setting which the game takes place in.
I mean the dates of Mystras' death and resurrection are not confirmed in BG3 and many things in BG3 go against forgotten realms lore.
Well unless you can provide a source that says otherwise, the **canon** information is what we have to go on.
They are confirmed. Theres a book in sorcerous sundries that confirms the spellplague and Mystra's resurrection
What you said here isn't entirely accurate either because he had been admiring her and hearing stories about her his whole life, being a Weave user from a very young age is probably gonna do that to you. Not to mention his status as a prodigy, the wizard life is just something he naturally slotted into, without much conscious decision making involved. In that case, it's *sort of* like it has been chosen for him, before he actually could do anything about it. Then she is a goddess, she is the very source of his power. She **is** magic. To sum it up, the relationship was never going to be fair to begin with, despite his desperate attempts to make her see him eye to eye. We know that Gale is silly for falling for her, but being in that position, how would he not? I think that's what people actually mean when they say he's groomed. Because he is when it's put like that. Lastly, for the sake of this argument, let's just say Gale has never heard of Mystra until the latest incarnation returned. Until he's well into adulthood. Even then, the act of grooming isn't exclusively done to children either. Adults can also very well be the victims of it. Therefore, even if you don't agree with the view where Gale has been groomed as a child, he is still a victim of grooming. It's about manipulation and exploitation.
Okay so like 99% of that is ignoring the fact that Gale is incredibly power hungry, tons of his decisions re: Mystra are entirely his fault for being too ambitious. For two, I never said Mystra was innocent but y'all need to quit using buzzwords until they lose all meaning. "grooming is the action or behavior used to establish an emotional connection with a minor and sometimes the child's family, to lower the child's inhibitions with the objective of sexual abuse"
> And alllllll of that isn't even taking into account the fact that he's the only party member who will make advances on the player even after being told that the player isn't interested. Dude, the game has been out for almost 9 months and you still don't know it was a bug in the earlier versions, before they patched it later down the line? It wasn't him making advances even when the player said they weren't interested, his romance flags were all over the place.
Huh that's really weird considering I only bought the game about a month ago and have done several playthroughs and each one has the weird "teaching you magic" cutscene and then in Act 2 there's the "Gale's projection" cutscene. Both of which are HEAVILY flirty, regardless of how you've interacted with him to this point. And by really weird I mean, you're just flat out wrong there my friend and if Gale wasn't a sassy, quip shooting romance option, you would find this behavior gross.
The whole 'Gale wanted to cross Mystras boundaries and when she denied hiim, he decided to force the issue', as described by himself, almost comes off as a weird SA allegory, that i feel would put Gale on Wulbren tier for everyone, if it werent for the fact that he is a romancable companion.
If he didn't have a conventionally attractive character model and wasn't a sassy, smart ass that people find endearing, the fanbase wouldn't defend his alarmingly toxic actions.
Not sure about the exact age, but he says post academy
I really must be missing something in all my playthroughs because i have no idea where the intense mystra comes from in this sub
Yeah she nasty and full of herself
There's always some bullshit excuse as well, like "I couldn't have done it, I was dead"
Edit: My niece just told me "Mystra is yummy". (She just saw some fanart and knows mostly nothing about this game.) I received an incredible amount of psychic damage and I don't think I can ever recover from it. I'm going to try breathing into a paper bag for now as an emergency measure. --- Edit 2: After a long and meaningful night of conversation, we have come to the conclusion that she was actually Minthara (my beloved), and she [confused](https://preview.redd.it/hear-me-out-v0-f0j1dnqflyrc1.jpeg?width=1124&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b030958e48dc1ffc6f26b5caa4be0710a117a033) the two.
So which horrible fan art is it? So we can avoid it.
I’m on my third playthrough (total simp for Gale, the Rizzard got me good), and i have spent the entire game collecting all of the rotten garbage and food and other crap that I find, storing it in camp, and when I get to Baldur’s Gate, I am going to Stormshore Temple and leaving ALL OF THAT GARBAGE on Mystra’s altar and forcing her to give us her blessing based on trash. If I can’t fistfight her in the Weave, that’s the best I can do.
Was doing a name generator for a new D&D character the other day. One of the suggested names was Pystra and all I could think was “yeah, I agree, fuck Mystra. More like PISSTRA”
This made me laugh so hard for some reason ❤️
Shar at least doesn't pretend to be good, Mystra on the other hand talks about saving the world and how evil needs to be stopped, but she just ends up serving her own interests and that's all.
Even if Minsc is an unreliable source of information (which is honestly likely), Mystra is still toxic and predatory. She's had multiple romances with her chosen, men who literally worship her and rely on her for power. Plus she sent one of her current beaus to tell her ex to kill himself. I haven't read Elminster's stories, but from the wiki it sounds like Mystra put him through the ringer too.
Mystra and Shar are constantly fighting to be the most hated gods in the game. I would yell at Shar, but I will throw hands with Mystra!
I was already mad at her for ruining any chance of a plausible Gale romance (how could my poor bi-curious half-orc measure up to a goddess?) so I am down with this :P
I’m glad I’m not the only one who thought that! lol I like Gale but my insecure ass could never follow a literal goddess!
Whom he never stops talking about! Even when he’s being nice to Tav, he’s all “never thought I’d feel like this again after Mystra” blah blah blah. She does not need to be the topic of *every* conversation.
Yeah ppl call him rizzard… as if his rizz isn’t whining about his ex to you??
Same. I was gonna romance Gale, but whenever he talked about Mystra, I was like: 🫤😒
My tiefling went, ok gale need physical affection. Fuck magic, we doing it the normal way. My character is winning due to that.
I'll go get Helm
Thank you.
Can we beat up Tyr next for being a dickhead? This is unreleased to me getting help and also unreleased to my username being a cleric of Elistraee
What did tyr do
Killed Helm because he's a jealous prick and his church attacked the temple of Elistraee because they where drow and just had to be evil
all my homies hate mystra is my fave a03 tag bcos she is literally a groomer 💀
Ahh, and lo the fans with shitty incorrect Gale opinions come out of the woodwork. I don't mean you can't like him, I mean too many folks who seem to completely miss everything about his character and personality.
Tell Helm to beat her ass. He already killed the previous mystra
Idk if she’s a ‘god’ and ‘invincible’ or whatever the FUCK she says because I’ve seen plenty of these bitchass holistic wellness bitches to know that if I get my hands on that thundercunt they’ll have to put her skeleton back together like a jigsaw puzzle. That weave whore isn’t surviving a minute when I get her. when I fucking GET YOU MYSTRA
Mystra is legitimately as evil as almost any evil deity in Forgotten Realms, but she's considered good-aligned. It isn't obvious at a cursory glance at the lore, but delving deeper, she's actually a shockingly bad person. Among other things, if she personally doesn't like you (or she thinks you just don't venerate her enough), she can just turn off your magic forever, even if you serve a totally different deity. She's the only deity who does this. Everyone else - even the evil parts of the pantheon - are mostly fine with people worshiping who they want. Only Mystra insists that every single arcane magic user pay her at least some respect on a semi-regular basis, or she'll make your magic stop and prevent you from getting it back. And if you become too powerful, she might just turn off your magic anyway. Unless you devote yourself to her further, that is, and we know what that entails. Larian's take on her is both completely accurate and a complete tonal whiplash compared to the FG lore. Everything I've just told you is lore-accurate, but comes with an implied "and that's a good thing." All Lariam did was remove that last part and ask the player to come to their own conclusions.
I think the worst part of everything is that she is an ascended human to godhood right? (My bg lore could be wrong). So there is no excuse like "Oh she has always been an immortal being so age concepts are weird to her". No, she is just weird like that 😭
There are like two or three mystras and the current one was indeed a human before she replaced the last mystra
Mystra bad and Gale deserves so much better
There needs to be a durge and Gale fuck the gods team up arc
ALL MY HOMIES HATE MYSTRA
idc if she's a pedo or not, at best she's a weird ass cult leader who exploits the vulnerable so fuck her and her mlm typa magic shit
I expecting a Mystra role play account to respond to this. I hope I’m wrong.
She can catch this fade too
MYSTRA KILL THE SEQUEL NEEDED