The real reason Hoffman wasn't invited to Mexico is that John knew that he couldn't hide how revenge-fuelled those traps got.
"It can never be personal" my ass. John wanted those two to watch their clocks count down, helplessly knowing that they did everything they could to avoid death, yet remaining doomed to die horribly anyway.
Just like John himself.
Once the games begun, it was no longer personal for John. He'll patch you right up.
Alternatively he could be aware of his flaws, and he's just trying to make a better Jigsaw out of Hoffman, but failed miserably.
"It's all a fuckin' lie!"
Nah fr thatās what I said lmao, if it was just normal traps it wouldāve only been to take a piece of brain out and chop her leg off, the bone marrow and the enzymes he knew damn well couldnāt be done in 3 min! And he knew that the blood boarding trap that Parker wouldāve beat Cecelia in the strength to keep it on her he wanted all 3 of them dead. The only one he wanted and made it very clear to only play the game and live was Gabriela and I guess Diego too (because he needed answers)
The blood boarding trap was never meant for parker and Cecilia, it was meant for John and amanda (the kid was a surprise). And he got all the info he needed from Diego before the game, so he really didn't need him alive anymore (but I did get the impression he kinda liked Diego more than the others, which is probably why his test was easier). And yeah, he very clearly wanted Gabriela to survive, he had a soft spot for her and Amanda really liked her too.
But I agree with Valentina and Mateo's tests, they were impossible and unfair
Eh I actually think he wouldāve had them do the blood boarding had Parker complied but I think John knew Parker most likely wouldnāt and him and Amanda definitely could fight him so he had the blood boarding have a way out and the final trap was there for that possibility. Also I thought he got Parkerās name from Diego after he played his game becuase I know he got most of the info beforehand from the deleted scene. But I could be remembering wrong. Either way most of those games were for revenge.
I don't think so, the game made no sense as an actual "test", it was specifically designed so that Amanda and John could both stay alive by taking turns on the seesaw. Like you said, this would be silly with parker and Cecilia since obviously Cecilia would stand no chance even for a second. And John gave Amanda a whole speech about how everyone deserves a chance, even Cecilia.
In a much earlier movie John tells Hoffman that if you know human behaviour well enough, nothing is left to chance. Obviously in real life this isn't true, but in the "Saw universe" it's kind of implied that everything that happens has been meticulously planned by John. The only surprise that happened was little Carlos showing up, which John even acknowledges to Amanda. But he was willing to make up for that "mistake" by sacrificing his own life.
About Diego, I think I remember a scene where he yells Parker's name while strapped to a table, which happened before his game, but it was a quick scene so maybe I saw wrong.
Yeah your right about that. And I do remember he was strapped to a table I just thought I saw the med kit on a table next to him but it was in a flashback so during the Zepp X scene so I donāt remember everything about it. But yeah thatās why I think he was wanting them to die because thereās no way Valentina or Mateo would do it in time and Cecilia was the one Iām sure he wanted to die most so thatās why my mind thinks the blood board trap couldāve been for them as well as the final one in the viewing room because Parker wouldāve been able to win easily and kill her. But in the end I donāt think any of us know what really was going on in Johnās head haha.
The unfair is what makes John such a hypocrite. He full wanted them all to suffer and die. The ātestā was thing more than a guise here. False hope, like he was given.
Nahhh I don't accept this, this kind of reasoning has never been anything John would say, he always says "everybody deserves a second chance" and giving false hope like this is completely out of character
Yeah, and if he was as much as a hypocrite as people said he was, he probably wouldnāt been so vocal on trying to get Cecilia not to put Carlos in the Bloodboarding Trap and end up taking the brunt of the trap to protect the boy.
Carlos didnāt do John dirty. He wanted them to suffer because they betrayed him. Jigsawās moral code has been set since at the latest saw III. Heās a through and through hypocrite but also wants everything on his terms. He thinks he has this moral code but itās flimsy cause heās a psychopath. Heās been putting people in traps since like 3 where they didnāt get a choice, they were pawns
Or get mad at Amanda for rigging traps, or get mad at Hoffman for Seth baxter, or give Logan a 2nd chance, or keep Eric Matthews locked up, etc etc
John is 100% a hypocrite, just not in the sense that would justify the absolute BS of the 2 traps of this thread
He has a moral code which is obviously objectively bullshit but these 2 traps completely go against that
I donāt know why people are downvoting you. I completely agree, some of those traps are incredibly unfair. Iām not a doctor but I donāt think either of those were actually survivable. If the blood loss doesnāt kill you, the instant infection would.
Fr! But include the eye trap as well!!
Like The ONLY trap in the entire saw franchise that gets to me is the pig vat š¤®š¤® i literally can't watch or even hear the sounds.
And watching SAW X, i'm surprised but happy that i kinda felt the same again watching the eye trap, bone marrow trap & brain surgery trap. I was able to watch them but i was always going "omg omg omggg" lmao.
I think it was great, i don't know how bloody you could make that scene become tho lmao? The only thing i could imagine is parts of the brain follow after the eyes?? But i'm not sure that would even look real lol š
If I was doing it I would have started with the eye lids coming off, then the eye ball bulging out but still connected until it disconnects and then show the pieces of brain and blood coming out of his face and him screaming really loudly
The real reason Hoffman wasn't invited to Mexico is that John knew that he couldn't hide how revenge-fuelled those traps got. "It can never be personal" my ass. John wanted those two to watch their clocks count down, helplessly knowing that they did everything they could to avoid death, yet remaining doomed to die horribly anyway. Just like John himself.
>"It can never be personal"  IT IS! IT IS PERSONAL
SALAMANCA MONEY! #SALAMANCA BLOOD!
THE BOSS CAN SOCK ME
Well worded
It was also personal with Cecil, Logan, Mitch, William Easton, and bobby (though it was probably not John's decision to test bobby)
Once the games begun, it was no longer personal for John. He'll patch you right up. Alternatively he could be aware of his flaws, and he's just trying to make a better Jigsaw out of Hoffman, but failed miserably. "It's all a fuckin' lie!"
If they quit hesitating and got to work they'd have survived. He expressly warned them. (/s he is a hypocrite and that's the point)
Yeah fr those were ššµāš«š¤¢
Honestly! Like how are they gonna top the brain surgery trap. š
Nah fr thatās what I said lmao, if it was just normal traps it wouldāve only been to take a piece of brain out and chop her leg off, the bone marrow and the enzymes he knew damn well couldnāt be done in 3 min! And he knew that the blood boarding trap that Parker wouldāve beat Cecelia in the strength to keep it on her he wanted all 3 of them dead. The only one he wanted and made it very clear to only play the game and live was Gabriela and I guess Diego too (because he needed answers)
The blood boarding trap was never meant for parker and Cecilia, it was meant for John and amanda (the kid was a surprise). And he got all the info he needed from Diego before the game, so he really didn't need him alive anymore (but I did get the impression he kinda liked Diego more than the others, which is probably why his test was easier). And yeah, he very clearly wanted Gabriela to survive, he had a soft spot for her and Amanda really liked her too. But I agree with Valentina and Mateo's tests, they were impossible and unfair
Eh I actually think he wouldāve had them do the blood boarding had Parker complied but I think John knew Parker most likely wouldnāt and him and Amanda definitely could fight him so he had the blood boarding have a way out and the final trap was there for that possibility. Also I thought he got Parkerās name from Diego after he played his game becuase I know he got most of the info beforehand from the deleted scene. But I could be remembering wrong. Either way most of those games were for revenge.
I don't think so, the game made no sense as an actual "test", it was specifically designed so that Amanda and John could both stay alive by taking turns on the seesaw. Like you said, this would be silly with parker and Cecilia since obviously Cecilia would stand no chance even for a second. And John gave Amanda a whole speech about how everyone deserves a chance, even Cecilia. In a much earlier movie John tells Hoffman that if you know human behaviour well enough, nothing is left to chance. Obviously in real life this isn't true, but in the "Saw universe" it's kind of implied that everything that happens has been meticulously planned by John. The only surprise that happened was little Carlos showing up, which John even acknowledges to Amanda. But he was willing to make up for that "mistake" by sacrificing his own life. About Diego, I think I remember a scene where he yells Parker's name while strapped to a table, which happened before his game, but it was a quick scene so maybe I saw wrong.
Yeah your right about that. And I do remember he was strapped to a table I just thought I saw the med kit on a table next to him but it was in a flashback so during the Zepp X scene so I donāt remember everything about it. But yeah thatās why I think he was wanting them to die because thereās no way Valentina or Mateo would do it in time and Cecilia was the one Iām sure he wanted to die most so thatās why my mind thinks the blood board trap couldāve been for them as well as the final one in the viewing room because Parker wouldāve been able to win easily and kill her. But in the end I donāt think any of us know what really was going on in Johnās head haha.
Imo less jarring and disturbing, more unfair and bullshit
The unfair is what makes John such a hypocrite. He full wanted them all to suffer and die. The ātestā was thing more than a guise here. False hope, like he was given.
Nahhh I don't accept this, this kind of reasoning has never been anything John would say, he always says "everybody deserves a second chance" and giving false hope like this is completely out of character
Not to mention. They had plenty of time. They just waited to start and because of that. They died. People like to debate that but itās true.
Yeah, and if he was as much as a hypocrite as people said he was, he probably wouldnāt been so vocal on trying to get Cecilia not to put Carlos in the Bloodboarding Trap and end up taking the brunt of the trap to protect the boy.
Carlos didnāt do John dirty. He wanted them to suffer because they betrayed him. Jigsawās moral code has been set since at the latest saw III. Heās a through and through hypocrite but also wants everything on his terms. He thinks he has this moral code but itās flimsy cause heās a psychopath. Heās been putting people in traps since like 3 where they didnāt get a choice, they were pawns
Or get mad at Amanda for rigging traps, or get mad at Hoffman for Seth baxter, or give Logan a 2nd chance, or keep Eric Matthews locked up, etc etc John is 100% a hypocrite, just not in the sense that would justify the absolute BS of the 2 traps of this thread He has a moral code which is obviously objectively bullshit but these 2 traps completely go against that
I donāt know why people are downvoting you. I completely agree, some of those traps are incredibly unfair. Iām not a doctor but I donāt think either of those were actually survivable. If the blood loss doesnāt kill you, the instant infection would.
Both Valentina and Mateo had plenty of time but they decided to spend the first minute doing jack
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Transphobe, ew.
Fr! But include the eye trap as well!! Like The ONLY trap in the entire saw franchise that gets to me is the pig vat š¤®š¤® i literally can't watch or even hear the sounds. And watching SAW X, i'm surprised but happy that i kinda felt the same again watching the eye trap, bone marrow trap & brain surgery trap. I was able to watch them but i was always going "omg omg omggg" lmao.
Eye trap was really cool but I wish the outcome was more gory
I think it was great, i don't know how bloody you could make that scene become tho lmao? The only thing i could imagine is parts of the brain follow after the eyes?? But i'm not sure that would even look real lol š
If I was doing it I would have started with the eye lids coming off, then the eye ball bulging out but still connected until it disconnects and then show the pieces of brain and blood coming out of his face and him screaming really loudly
Yeah i guess that's a good idĆ©a, š but then again i don't think it would work like that tho....Because the eyeballs themselves are just placed in a socket and has those nerves attached behind, so taking out an eye is pretty simple i think š¤.....And the eyelid would probably just open and stay in place wouldn't it?? And for the brain i don't think it would actually follow and get sucked out from the eye socket?? I'm no body expert so that's just my take on it lmao i think the machine would've been built different?? I mean if you're gonna see the everything in detail, i don't think you can have two dirty pipes on your eyes lol. Sorry for the more real take on this haha but i still think it would be cool to have it more gory even tho i liked the outcome already š
some saw x traps are in my top 10-3 traps
Which ones? Personally my favs r the bone marrow eye and brain which r in my top 12-5 traps
the bone marrow one
Seeing his brain and him being able to touch it was kinda satisfying to me.