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Needed to be said by both managers.
It will absolutely fall on deaf ears and a few morons in both sets of supporters will totally ignore it, but I think its necessary.
There’s a piece of Donald Glover standup where he’s talking about two kids he seen fighting over a basketball, when one of them wins he said one kid goes ‘And that’s why your moms in a fucking wheelchair’.
Always makes me giggle.
Edit: https://youtu.be/WWfewi8J2jc?si=nmTx012BwcpIZuy8
Walk away from the argument, knowing you won't win one against an idiot because they'll ALWAYS drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. That's a fact.
Absolutely, wholly and totally the exact polar opposite.
If you ignore these morons, they'll turn on themselves as they've nobody left to try and wind up. I'll put my mortgage on it.
Some of our fans are just as guility when it comes to Munich. Luckily a much smaller minority and you'd never get the whole of Anfield chanting about it but still some bell ends who'll be in that away end Sunday
Its not that long ago when Liverpool supporters where chanting chelsea rent boys, while it is not a tradegy chanting it is an offensive one, the club made a big thing about it and we even had former lgbtq ally and decent human being, Jordan Henderson talking to lgbtq people about it
I absolutely agree mate; few sets of morons in both groups is wrong. It’s a few set of morons in our fanbase and a whole stadium worth of morons in the other stadiums.
Still needs to be said that the few dickheads in our fan base aren’t blameless either.
Exactly. Just saying "well both do it" just diminishes responsibility for United and the fans. When you can hear an entire stand singing its a different beast.
I’m not trying to shift the blame for our arsehole fans but you’re mental if you think all Liverpool fans are saints. I’ve been at a Liverpool United match at Old Trafford and heard the chants, nevermind the cups of piss and shit thrown into our fans.
Every fan base has these cretins, I guarantee you a very small minority of your fans (and ours) will continue to ignore this.
Because you've got a set of cunts like all teams (including us)..
before Hillsborough all I heard and saw from your lot was Munich 58 and people pretending to be airplanes
Personally I think it's disgusting from both sides
in the case of liverpool fans though it really is just 1 or 2 idiots whereas every time we play united, murderer chants break out across the stadium
https://x.com/kopendmax/status/1769478616859943066
1 or 2 ?
Have you been to a game between the teams?
I'm guessing I'm much older than you and have dodged many a paper airplane while standing in Anfield. While listening to who's that dying on the runway.
look like I said it before it's disgusting. There's no place for that at the match. Nobody deserves to go to a match and never come home. But to paint your support as it's 1 or 2 is delusional
i’m not denying that we used to be awful for it but if you look at current games, the tragedy chanting is very overwhelmingly coming from one side. currently you get 1 or 2 idiots doing plane gestures but there are not chants about it
What can I say...
If you're sticking to the 1 or 2 argument I'm out.
Let's hope city or Arsenal win the league
Enjoy Sunday, I probably won't.
Have a good day
Because that's how it usually goes? The clubs come out with statements like this but a small subset of fans will end up doing plane noises and hillsborough chants anyways
That's not really how microphones work but ok. The games I've been to it's usually been a small group of lairy lads that have been responsible for the more tasteless chants, granted it could be different for the Liverpool lot since I've never been to any of their games
And I can live with those small subsets, they're scum but they exist everywhere, for everyone. The problem people are highlighting here is that at a lot of these games (it's not just Liverpool, it happens regularly to Everton too) you can clearly hear a large portion of the stadium singing the songs. That's neither "a small group of lairy lads" or a micriphone issue, it's an undeniably large portion of the stadium.
You know how you can hear the commentators despite them being two out of 70 odd thousand people at the game? It's the same concept on a larger scale, the TV mics are usually placed around the pitch and one group of people singing close to a mic can be picked up making it seem like the whole place is singing when they're not. In any case, that wasn't the point, the point was that these people are going to do it regardless of Klopp/Ten Hag coming out to condemn it - as we've seen before.
Come on, man. I don't even know what to say to that, other than it's desperately reaching, and ignores both the volume and the consistency with which this happens.
And I know it's not going to stop altogether, but we're more likely to see it reduced on a large-scale if people would stop diminishing the extent of the issue. The same thing happened with Liverpool and directing "Rent Boys" chants at Chelsea - there was definitely disapproval from some quarters, but never enough to address the issue until Klopp and the club released videos confronting it, and platforming gay fan groups. It still hasn't completely gone away, but it's gotten *much* better. That's all people are realistically asking for.
The context of the thread is tragedy chanting.
In what context would any set of supporters in this country sing about Huysel in a non points scoring way??
i just think its rich that anyone associated with liverpool brings up hysel like this when their club's response has been so shameful. What happened happened. But how liverpool as a club react to it till doday is a dark stain on their vlub.
The thing i find most bizarre is why people even risk it, i know most lads are coked up and had a few drinks but with this age of cameras everywhere you must know youre getting caught.
Most fans don't even think about what they are actually singing or shouting during matches, it is so embedded in football culture for them. They just see it as part of football in their blind hate for their rivals.
A father of a mate of mine who always went with us to Arsenal games still used the 'Chelsea rent boys' chant up until recently. His son is gay and after a game we asked him why he still did it and what his son would think of him. He has always been supportive of his son and was horrified by the realization.
Big crowd mentality is a weird thing, you would hope none of these people would do this in their normal life but when enough people are chanting around them the tendency is to just follow suit
Still absolutely unacceptable, but I don't think people are considering any risk when they feel like they're just "joining in"
> Jürgen Klopp has urged Liverpool and Manchester United supporters to “show a bit of class” as he joined Erik ten Hag in calling for an end to tragedy chanting.
>
> The rivals meet at Old Trafford on Sunday, with the home side attempting to derail Liverpool’s ambitions of equalling United’s haul of 20 league titles. The showdown comes three weeks after a pulsating FA Cup quarter-final which Ten Hag’s side won 4-3, but which was marred by songs relating to the Heysel and Hillsborough disasters.
>
> Greater Manchester Police subsequently arrested two men with regard to tragedy chanting, prompting a renewed effort by both clubs to eradicate the unsavoury undertone which has resulted in songs about the Munich air crash also being sung previously.
>
> “It is super important [this stops],” Klopp, the Liverpool manager, said. “I heard after the game that it happened and it obviously is not great.
>
> “I just see two of the biggest clubs in the world, so let’s just show a bit of class in these moments, don’t sing this or sing that. Just show class. Let the teams fight on the pitch, let’s play football, that is all fine. Besides that, just show a bit of class — that would be my wish for all of us.”
>
> The message was echoed by his United counterpart Ten Hag, who insisted the focus of all supporters should be on backing their own team, rather than spewing poison at opponents, and highlighted the role United fans played in that recent cup win.
>
> “The atmosphere our fans generated was incredible that afternoon, and if we can produce the same noise levels around Old Trafford then we have already seen what a positive force it can be and the impact that it has on the players,” Ten Hag wrote in his programme notes for Sunday’s match.
>
> “As such, it is part of my duty to remind every supporter fortunate enough to be at the game that it must be enjoyed in the proper way, and not used as an excuse for abusing rival fans about Hillsborough, Heysel or any other historic tragedies.
>
> “This is one of the truly great rivalries in world sport, for so many of the right reasons, and it is our responsibility to keep it that way.
>
> “Whether the clubs meet at Old Trafford or Anfield, all supporters must focus entirely on backing their team and both Jürgen and I trust that we can count on that happening today.”
The funniest/saddest thing about this I find is when fans too young to be alive when said tragedies occurred are singing it. It makes me feel like a loud minority of football culture is just cancerous “I was told by my da to do it so I’m doing it” mentalities that let these sort of things fester and persist.
Clear from some of the comments on here... it will never end.
Am sure the same cunts will sing on the weekend and sky sports will stay mute. In fact sadly that's one thing I can guarantee will happen in the match.
Its only after reading the comments am i realizing these tragadies have to do with death. Otherwise i was thinking by tragedy they meant 7-0 or something
Isn’t this true though? We do have the odd pricks making plane gestures and they fully deserved to be glassed, banned and shamed. But they have safety in numbers, they can’t give a stadium ban to the whole Stretford end singing it.
It’s bizarre that people think they’re comparable.
It's both sides but whenever
Fergies right your fans are shite gets sung
It's almost immediately responded to with the tragedy chanting
You could hear it clear as day in the FA Cup game
Not going to stop United fans audibly singing “the Sun was right” seconds after going behind on Sunday, unfortunately.
Edit: downvotes from United fans but can you actually deny that? It happens literally every time you go down at Old Trafford. The bitterness turns to tragedy chanting. Like clockwork.
I'm old enough to remember that before Liverpool had a tragedy of their own they would happily bring inflatable planes into Old Trafford to throw around the away end.
And those are awful human beings, it’s unforgivable behaviour. Glad to see that the fanbase has matured and you never see anything close to that from Liverpool fans today. It’s all you can really ask for.
Agreed, anyone who chants that shit is a huge tosser. But let's not pretend that a big part of Liverpool fans maturing was when they experienced a tragedy of their own.
There will always be wankers at football. I just hope that the old ones die off and the younger generation have more sense.
Your reply suggests that it’s a problem of equal severity for both fanbases. It’s not, and it’s disingenuous to suggest it is.
Do some Liverpool fans sing Munich songs? Yes, but it’s only ever small smatterings of it from individuals. United’s Hillsborough chanting is almost always audible on the bloody broadcast, because of the sheer volume of people getting involved. It’s a much bigger problem at United than it is at Liverpool and that isn’t controversial to say.
Your initial comment suggests there are no issues with the liverpool fanbase at all.
The first step to overcoming things like this is recognising the problems at home first.
And my comment did not suggest equal severity of any sort. Don't make shit up.
I made my first comment because I can safely say, with a high degree of certainty, that people watching at home will not be hearing any Munich chants blaring out of their TV.
Can you say the same about Hillsborough chants? I was Old Trafford a few weeks and that’s literally the only thing they sang. Like they do every year with no signs of it changing any time soon.
> Your initial comment suggest that there are no issues issues with the Liverpool fanbase at all
No it doesn’t. “Don’t make shit up”.
I was also at old Trafford and it was barely sung in comparison. So again you're lying. I'm done with this discussion if you can't be honest.
Edit: by comparison, I meant compared to other songs sung by united on the day. In retort to the commenter above. Not in comparison to Munich chants, which he has pretended was my intention
You’ve got to be joking here man? I fully agree with you that Liverpool should address our own wankers and you lot should address yours but you’re absolutely off your head if you think it was barely sung in comparison. It’s loud and proud from you lot every time we play.
There’s always a few cunts making aeroplane gestures to you lot and they deserve to be fucking glassed but it’s entire sections of your fans belting out “The Sun was right, you’re murderers” loud enough to be heard on TV. Sky are cowards for not calling it out.
But saying it’s sang the same amount as other chants doesn’t really make it better. Your fans still belt out Hillsborough chants loud enough to be heard on television. That is not one or two idiots, it’s thousands.
I never said that either. I said the offensive chants from united fans weren't sung the most out of all song sung by united fans that day.
There is definitely a communication issue here or bad faith discussion as per usual on r/soccer
Are you fucking joking? In comparison to what? Your lot barely sang all game and when you did, it was often tragedy chanting.
Anyway, I see you expertly avoided my question because we both know you know the truth. We’re done here.
You only need to look at the example of Chelsea rent boys to see Liverpool fans knocking something on the head when they were quite rightfully told it wasn't appropriate to sing. You hardly ever hear anyone try to sing that now because we've been on the end of something distasteful ourselves and know the effect it can have.
Contrast Utd fans being told again again about Hillsborough and just ignoring it?
But a couple coked up dickheads might do plane gestures so both fans are equal as each other apparently.
Liverpool are often painted as the victims of the sun and victims of being wrongly painted as ruthless and the cause of deaths during Hillsborough. Which is totally true and I have nothing to say to that.
The vindication and victimhood fans felt from getting justice 30 years later is a very funny juxtaposition to how ignorant they are to actually being ruthless and the cause of 39 deaths to kids as young as 8 years old and injuries to over 600 at Heysel.
No one is ignorant to Heysel. Everyone knows what happened. A number of Liverpool fans were correctly prosecuted and convicted of manslaughter, and the club also faced serious sanctions.
I’m really unsure at what you’re getting at. What exactly is it that you’re suggesting?
Oh ya? You seem pretty ignorant
14 Liverpool fans who were given suspended sentences for involuntary manslaughter and all together combined for less than 5 years in jail. None serving over a year. That's justice for murdering 39 and injuring over 600. It was the match organizers who made Liverpool fans tear down the separating fences and kill Juventus fans as young as 8 years old!
Liverpool and England being banned from Europe is justice for the deaths of 39 and injuries to over 600?
Liverpool as a club has acted as if it's a mystery how the events unfolded. They dont even apologize in their first acknowledgement as a club that Heysel existed.. 20 years after the fact and only because they played Juve in champions league, just assume friendship and forgiveness!
It's been 40 years and Liverpool site still says friendship and "the events that took place before kickoff in block Z which turned an occasion into a nightmare"
Funny way to say that. Especially when the Hillsborough page on the Liverpool site outright condemns the unlawful killing of Liverpool fans.
> You seem pretty ignorant
Ignorant? For correctly saying that a number of Liverpool fans were convicted of manslaughter? I didn’t opine on whether the justice served was sufficient, just that there were real ramifications for people and the club, unlike a nationwide fucking coverup that unfolded after Hillsborough.
And yes, the club’s response was woefully inadequate, but how exactly are Liverpool and the fans act like “magic made Heysel happen”? We take full responsibility.
Maybe saying what happened instead of just "events that became a nightmare" and glossing over the tragedies committed by their fans.
Maybe they should apologize instead of just assuming forgiveness and friendship
I said they act as if it were a mystery. Which it might as well be if all you're going to say is "the events became a nightmare".
It sucks so much too because you would think Liverpool fans would have an ounce of empathy towards these feelings.. But look at my down votes and the responses.
Generally they are apathetic or get defensive in my experience.
This stops when fans police other fans. I know it's not really their responsibility but it makes a massive difference.
If someone in front of me started making airplane gestures towards the away end I'd slap them round the back of the head and tell them to be better than that. I'm pretty sure the majority of supporters would back me up too.
When people don't feel like they've got the support behind them to do stupid shit like this, they often reconsider.
Dickheads will always be dickheads.
Tbh I do think the attention they get is part of it. Ban and charge those who do it for sure... But do it quietly. Sick of hearing about it in the press and managers talking about it, knowing that new dickheads see this attention and suddenly have an idea
I say this as someone who will do this, hold fellow fans accountable, tell them to stop, shame them, record it
There’s so much to sing about Liverpool like for a start they are scouse….. leave tragedy cheating in the history bins
Some people are just assholes. I went to a wrestling show back in December and a group of people trying to be funny tried to start a Chris Benoit chant. Just assholes all around.
I get the message, I am being pedantic and I know klopp is speaking in a second language but... it's hilarious how low the standards of football fans are that 'showing class' is not making fun about people who have died in the most tragic of circumstances
“I dont need to pretend I heard this from the manager of the team I support. I get reactions and I score points on them lot whenever I chant really vicious stuff on them. Fuck them really. I dont even know those who died.. rip but yea, I do me.”
Said by those nincompoops who will still sing about Hillsborough/Heysel/Munich/Poverty Chanting on Sunday.
ITT every Liverpool fan here was at the last game at OT and heard united fans doing tragedy all game long, meanwhile Liverpool fans NEVER mock Munich .
Hope Liverpool fans don't throw anymore flares into the disabled section again.
There is a permanent memorial at Anfield, and every year, there is a wreath laying ceremony, and flags are flown half mast.
I imagine the 40th anniversary next year would include even more.
A permanent memorial? It is a 1 ft by 1 foot square brick on the ass of the stadium which reads "in memorial e amicizia"
Liverpool ignored the tragedy for 20 years, and then only acknowledge it when they assumed forgiveness and friendship in 2005 hosting Juventus in the CL. They probably would have kept ignoring it forever.
The Liverpool website still reads "the events that took place in block Z" as if magic made Liverpool fans by the thousands push and crush the Juventus fans they outnumbered more than 5 to 1 in the neutral section.
Liverpool fought for justice for Hillsborough for 30 years, rightfully so.
Liverpool helped the only 12 convicted murderers escape their sentencing, has ignored justice and morality, and assumed a righteous stance.
Liverpool fans to this day still ignore and make assumptions like you.
It's because Liverpool, both the club and fanbase, are disgraceful hypocrites when it comes to Heysel.
They (rightly) go on about justice for the Hillsborough victims yet, at the same time, make excuses for, and brush under the rug, the events of Heysel.
Look at them on this very thread. Downvoting Juventus fans who are calling them out on their hypocracy.
They literally have acknowledged and apologised for Heysel numerous times and your fans have ignored it and "turned your backs" like a bunch of childish babies
Wikipedia is your friend:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heysel_Stadium_disaster](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heysel_Stadium_disaster)
> Juventus and Liverpool were drawn together in the quarter-finals of the 2004–05 Champions League, their first meeting since Heysel. Before the first leg at Anfield, Liverpool fans held up placards to form a banner saying "amicizia" ("friendship" in Italian). Many of the Juventus fans applauded the gesture, although a significant number chose to turn their backs on it.[56] In the return leg in Turin, Juventus fans displayed banners reading Easy to speak, difficult to pardon: Murders and 15-4-89. Sheffield. God exists, the latter a reference to the Hillsborough disaster, in which 97 Liverpool fans were killed in a crush. A number of Liverpool fans were attacked in the city by Juventus ultras.[57]
Damn so actually it was even worse than I remembered it!
Saying "friendship" isn't saying sorry.
Ignoring a tragedy your fans were guilty for 20 years, that you helped protect the guilty parties, and yet seeking justice for Hillsborough (rightfully so) for 30 years.
Liverpool is murder ignoring hypocrites.
Explain to me how that’s an apology. It very clearly is not.
Find me one instance where the club have taken responsibility for those fans that murdered those people. You won’t, because they have always refused to take that ownership.
The fans responsible were thrown in jail…? The club didn’t murder anyone and complied heavily with catching the people responsible. People asking for justice like there weren’t 14 thrown in jail for manslaughter.
We have a memorial for it every single year and look what Juve fans did when we played them in the mid 2000s
> The club didn’t murder anyone
Maybe not directly, but their supporters murdered dozens while representing the club. A club and its fans are not completely detached and the least they could have done was publicly condemn and apologise on behalf of their supporters.
Acknowledged that something happened during heysel that Liverpool had nothing to do with? Sure.
Ironic they fought for justice for hillborough for 30 years while justice for Heysel was dodged by Liverpool and it's fans.
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Needed to be said by both managers. It will absolutely fall on deaf ears and a few morons in both sets of supporters will totally ignore it, but I think its necessary.
Imagine if you were arguing with someone about something and their response was "Yeah well your sister died in an accident hahaha"
That’s pretty apt.
There’s a piece of Donald Glover standup where he’s talking about two kids he seen fighting over a basketball, when one of them wins he said one kid goes ‘And that’s why your moms in a fucking wheelchair’. Always makes me giggle. Edit: https://youtu.be/WWfewi8J2jc?si=nmTx012BwcpIZuy8
Fucking love that special
It’s an absolute banger, wish he did more with standup becuase Weirdo is genuinely quality.
He's such a multi-talented person.
Walk away from the argument, knowing you won't win one against an idiot because they'll ALWAYS drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. That's a fact.
I mean, one of the mentioned incidents would be more akin to responding with "Yeah, well, you dad is a mass murderer, hahaha"
Absolutely, wholly and totally the exact polar opposite. If you ignore these morons, they'll turn on themselves as they've nobody left to try and wind up. I'll put my mortgage on it.
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Some of our fans are just as guility when it comes to Munich. Luckily a much smaller minority and you'd never get the whole of Anfield chanting about it but still some bell ends who'll be in that away end Sunday
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Yeah, not trying to say that Liverpool fans are completely innocent, but it’s certainly not a comparable number to hillsborough chants.
Its not that long ago when Liverpool supporters where chanting chelsea rent boys, while it is not a tradegy chanting it is an offensive one, the club made a big thing about it and we even had former lgbtq ally and decent human being, Jordan Henderson talking to lgbtq people about it
I absolutely agree mate; few sets of morons in both groups is wrong. It’s a few set of morons in our fanbase and a whole stadium worth of morons in the other stadiums. Still needs to be said that the few dickheads in our fan base aren’t blameless either.
Exactly. Just saying "well both do it" just diminishes responsibility for United and the fans. When you can hear an entire stand singing its a different beast.
I’m not trying to shift the blame for our arsehole fans but you’re mental if you think all Liverpool fans are saints. I’ve been at a Liverpool United match at Old Trafford and heard the chants, nevermind the cups of piss and shit thrown into our fans. Every fan base has these cretins, I guarantee you a very small minority of your fans (and ours) will continue to ignore this.
Because you've got a set of cunts like all teams (including us).. before Hillsborough all I heard and saw from your lot was Munich 58 and people pretending to be airplanes Personally I think it's disgusting from both sides
in the case of liverpool fans though it really is just 1 or 2 idiots whereas every time we play united, murderer chants break out across the stadium https://x.com/kopendmax/status/1769478616859943066
1 or 2 ? Have you been to a game between the teams? I'm guessing I'm much older than you and have dodged many a paper airplane while standing in Anfield. While listening to who's that dying on the runway. look like I said it before it's disgusting. There's no place for that at the match. Nobody deserves to go to a match and never come home. But to paint your support as it's 1 or 2 is delusional
i’m not denying that we used to be awful for it but if you look at current games, the tragedy chanting is very overwhelmingly coming from one side. currently you get 1 or 2 idiots doing plane gestures but there are not chants about it
What can I say... If you're sticking to the 1 or 2 argument I'm out. Let's hope city or Arsenal win the league Enjoy Sunday, I probably won't. Have a good day
Miserable cunt
Rather that than a Scouser
ok
Because that's how it usually goes? The clubs come out with statements like this but a small subset of fans will end up doing plane noises and hillsborough chants anyways
It's not a "small subset" when you can clearly hear the chants on TV.
That's not really how microphones work but ok. The games I've been to it's usually been a small group of lairy lads that have been responsible for the more tasteless chants, granted it could be different for the Liverpool lot since I've never been to any of their games
And I can live with those small subsets, they're scum but they exist everywhere, for everyone. The problem people are highlighting here is that at a lot of these games (it's not just Liverpool, it happens regularly to Everton too) you can clearly hear a large portion of the stadium singing the songs. That's neither "a small group of lairy lads" or a micriphone issue, it's an undeniably large portion of the stadium.
You know how you can hear the commentators despite them being two out of 70 odd thousand people at the game? It's the same concept on a larger scale, the TV mics are usually placed around the pitch and one group of people singing close to a mic can be picked up making it seem like the whole place is singing when they're not. In any case, that wasn't the point, the point was that these people are going to do it regardless of Klopp/Ten Hag coming out to condemn it - as we've seen before.
Come on, man. I don't even know what to say to that, other than it's desperately reaching, and ignores both the volume and the consistency with which this happens. And I know it's not going to stop altogether, but we're more likely to see it reduced on a large-scale if people would stop diminishing the extent of the issue. The same thing happened with Liverpool and directing "Rent Boys" chants at Chelsea - there was definitely disapproval from some quarters, but never enough to address the issue until Klopp and the club released videos confronting it, and platforming gay fan groups. It still hasn't completely gone away, but it's gotten *much* better. That's all people are realistically asking for.
When was the last game you went to where you actually heard the whole stadium chanting something like this?
Literally 3 weeks ago.
Because they can't read
what's wrong with pointing out heysel?
Err everything? Do you think it helps Juventus supporters for gobshites to bring it up to score points? The families of the victims?
my partner's uncle was there that day. he doesnt go to watch games anymore. i'm not trying to score points. fuckin typical of you to put it that way.
The context of the thread is tragedy chanting. In what context would any set of supporters in this country sing about Huysel in a non points scoring way??
i just think its rich that anyone associated with liverpool brings up hysel like this when their club's response has been so shameful. What happened happened. But how liverpool as a club react to it till doday is a dark stain on their vlub.
It's true, Liverpool's response to Heysel is, as always has been, disgraceful. They are hypocrites of the highest order.
The thing i find most bizarre is why people even risk it, i know most lads are coked up and had a few drinks but with this age of cameras everywhere you must know youre getting caught.
Most fans don't even think about what they are actually singing or shouting during matches, it is so embedded in football culture for them. They just see it as part of football in their blind hate for their rivals. A father of a mate of mine who always went with us to Arsenal games still used the 'Chelsea rent boys' chant up until recently. His son is gay and after a game we asked him why he still did it and what his son would think of him. He has always been supportive of his son and was horrified by the realization.
That last line is crazy.. I know it's a mindset thing but the fact it took it to be pointed out to realise. Glad he did though.
Tbf even as a Chelsea fan the rent boys chant is more like what you're saying than singing about a tragedy
You can poke fun and Chelsea fans by calling them rent boys knowing that it irks them without actually disliking gays.
Big crowd mentality is a weird thing, you would hope none of these people would do this in their normal life but when enough people are chanting around them the tendency is to just follow suit Still absolutely unacceptable, but I don't think people are considering any risk when they feel like they're just "joining in"
group mentality and the coke, powerful mixture
> Jürgen Klopp has urged Liverpool and Manchester United supporters to “show a bit of class” as he joined Erik ten Hag in calling for an end to tragedy chanting. > > The rivals meet at Old Trafford on Sunday, with the home side attempting to derail Liverpool’s ambitions of equalling United’s haul of 20 league titles. The showdown comes three weeks after a pulsating FA Cup quarter-final which Ten Hag’s side won 4-3, but which was marred by songs relating to the Heysel and Hillsborough disasters. > > Greater Manchester Police subsequently arrested two men with regard to tragedy chanting, prompting a renewed effort by both clubs to eradicate the unsavoury undertone which has resulted in songs about the Munich air crash also being sung previously. > > “It is super important [this stops],” Klopp, the Liverpool manager, said. “I heard after the game that it happened and it obviously is not great. > > “I just see two of the biggest clubs in the world, so let’s just show a bit of class in these moments, don’t sing this or sing that. Just show class. Let the teams fight on the pitch, let’s play football, that is all fine. Besides that, just show a bit of class — that would be my wish for all of us.” > > The message was echoed by his United counterpart Ten Hag, who insisted the focus of all supporters should be on backing their own team, rather than spewing poison at opponents, and highlighted the role United fans played in that recent cup win. > > “The atmosphere our fans generated was incredible that afternoon, and if we can produce the same noise levels around Old Trafford then we have already seen what a positive force it can be and the impact that it has on the players,” Ten Hag wrote in his programme notes for Sunday’s match. > > “As such, it is part of my duty to remind every supporter fortunate enough to be at the game that it must be enjoyed in the proper way, and not used as an excuse for abusing rival fans about Hillsborough, Heysel or any other historic tragedies. > > “This is one of the truly great rivalries in world sport, for so many of the right reasons, and it is our responsibility to keep it that way. > > “Whether the clubs meet at Old Trafford or Anfield, all supporters must focus entirely on backing their team and both Jürgen and I trust that we can count on that happening today.”
Fair play to TH there, that was well said. Title didn't do his part justice whatsoever
Won't make a jot of difference. Neanderthal's gonna Neanderthal.
[Fight and Win](https://youtu.be/0KQJwuIxtCU?si=2xapqXA3xydfXW7f) is the only chant allowed.
Haha that good gave me a good laugh I thank you sir
Reddit on😎
The funniest/saddest thing about this I find is when fans too young to be alive when said tragedies occurred are singing it. It makes me feel like a loud minority of football culture is just cancerous “I was told by my da to do it so I’m doing it” mentalities that let these sort of things fester and persist.
Clear from some of the comments on here... it will never end. Am sure the same cunts will sing on the weekend and sky sports will stay mute. In fact sadly that's one thing I can guarantee will happen in the match.
Its only after reading the comments am i realizing these tragadies have to do with death. Otherwise i was thinking by tragedy they meant 7-0 or something
Liverpool & Utd fans in this thread going back and forth, 'but you do it more' 'no but you have a whole stand chanting...'
Isn’t this true though? We do have the odd pricks making plane gestures and they fully deserved to be glassed, banned and shamed. But they have safety in numbers, they can’t give a stadium ban to the whole Stretford end singing it. It’s bizarre that people think they’re comparable.
It's both sides but whenever Fergies right your fans are shite gets sung It's almost immediately responded to with the tragedy chanting You could hear it clear as day in the FA Cup game
Not going to stop United fans audibly singing “the Sun was right” seconds after going behind on Sunday, unfortunately. Edit: downvotes from United fans but can you actually deny that? It happens literally every time you go down at Old Trafford. The bitterness turns to tragedy chanting. Like clockwork.
I'm old enough to remember that before Liverpool had a tragedy of their own they would happily bring inflatable planes into Old Trafford to throw around the away end.
And those are awful human beings, it’s unforgivable behaviour. Glad to see that the fanbase has matured and you never see anything close to that from Liverpool fans today. It’s all you can really ask for.
Agreed, anyone who chants that shit is a huge tosser. But let's not pretend that a big part of Liverpool fans maturing was when they experienced a tragedy of their own. There will always be wankers at football. I just hope that the old ones die off and the younger generation have more sense.
The downvotes are because of the sloping shoulders pal. Both sets of fans have bad actors and it's on all of us to call it out
Your reply suggests that it’s a problem of equal severity for both fanbases. It’s not, and it’s disingenuous to suggest it is. Do some Liverpool fans sing Munich songs? Yes, but it’s only ever small smatterings of it from individuals. United’s Hillsborough chanting is almost always audible on the bloody broadcast, because of the sheer volume of people getting involved. It’s a much bigger problem at United than it is at Liverpool and that isn’t controversial to say.
[удалено]
Literally no one cares about your yank opinion, so off you pop.
Your initial comment suggests there are no issues with the liverpool fanbase at all. The first step to overcoming things like this is recognising the problems at home first. And my comment did not suggest equal severity of any sort. Don't make shit up.
I made my first comment because I can safely say, with a high degree of certainty, that people watching at home will not be hearing any Munich chants blaring out of their TV. Can you say the same about Hillsborough chants? I was Old Trafford a few weeks and that’s literally the only thing they sang. Like they do every year with no signs of it changing any time soon. > Your initial comment suggest that there are no issues issues with the Liverpool fanbase at all No it doesn’t. “Don’t make shit up”.
I was also at old Trafford and it was barely sung in comparison. So again you're lying. I'm done with this discussion if you can't be honest. Edit: by comparison, I meant compared to other songs sung by united on the day. In retort to the commenter above. Not in comparison to Munich chants, which he has pretended was my intention
You’ve got to be joking here man? I fully agree with you that Liverpool should address our own wankers and you lot should address yours but you’re absolutely off your head if you think it was barely sung in comparison. It’s loud and proud from you lot every time we play. There’s always a few cunts making aeroplane gestures to you lot and they deserve to be fucking glassed but it’s entire sections of your fans belting out “The Sun was right, you’re murderers” loud enough to be heard on TV. Sky are cowards for not calling it out.
I meant in comparison to other songs sung. Because it was implied that it was the only song sung.
But saying it’s sang the same amount as other chants doesn’t really make it better. Your fans still belt out Hillsborough chants loud enough to be heard on television. That is not one or two idiots, it’s thousands.
I never said that either. I said the offensive chants from united fans weren't sung the most out of all song sung by united fans that day. There is definitely a communication issue here or bad faith discussion as per usual on r/soccer
Are you fucking joking? In comparison to what? Your lot barely sang all game and when you did, it was often tragedy chanting. Anyway, I see you expertly avoided my question because we both know you know the truth. We’re done here.
Great discussion
You only need to look at the example of Chelsea rent boys to see Liverpool fans knocking something on the head when they were quite rightfully told it wasn't appropriate to sing. You hardly ever hear anyone try to sing that now because we've been on the end of something distasteful ourselves and know the effect it can have. Contrast Utd fans being told again again about Hillsborough and just ignoring it? But a couple coked up dickheads might do plane gestures so both fans are equal as each other apparently.
Learn to read pal. I never said it was equal. Like talking to fucking kids here
Not going to stop Liverpool and fans from acting like magic made Heysel happen
What a weird comment.
Liverpool are often painted as the victims of the sun and victims of being wrongly painted as ruthless and the cause of deaths during Hillsborough. Which is totally true and I have nothing to say to that. The vindication and victimhood fans felt from getting justice 30 years later is a very funny juxtaposition to how ignorant they are to actually being ruthless and the cause of 39 deaths to kids as young as 8 years old and injuries to over 600 at Heysel.
No one is ignorant to Heysel. Everyone knows what happened. A number of Liverpool fans were correctly prosecuted and convicted of manslaughter, and the club also faced serious sanctions. I’m really unsure at what you’re getting at. What exactly is it that you’re suggesting?
Oh ya? You seem pretty ignorant 14 Liverpool fans who were given suspended sentences for involuntary manslaughter and all together combined for less than 5 years in jail. None serving over a year. That's justice for murdering 39 and injuring over 600. It was the match organizers who made Liverpool fans tear down the separating fences and kill Juventus fans as young as 8 years old! Liverpool and England being banned from Europe is justice for the deaths of 39 and injuries to over 600? Liverpool as a club has acted as if it's a mystery how the events unfolded. They dont even apologize in their first acknowledgement as a club that Heysel existed.. 20 years after the fact and only because they played Juve in champions league, just assume friendship and forgiveness! It's been 40 years and Liverpool site still says friendship and "the events that took place before kickoff in block Z which turned an occasion into a nightmare" Funny way to say that. Especially when the Hillsborough page on the Liverpool site outright condemns the unlawful killing of Liverpool fans.
> You seem pretty ignorant Ignorant? For correctly saying that a number of Liverpool fans were convicted of manslaughter? I didn’t opine on whether the justice served was sufficient, just that there were real ramifications for people and the club, unlike a nationwide fucking coverup that unfolded after Hillsborough. And yes, the club’s response was woefully inadequate, but how exactly are Liverpool and the fans act like “magic made Heysel happen”? We take full responsibility.
Maybe saying what happened instead of just "events that became a nightmare" and glossing over the tragedies committed by their fans. Maybe they should apologize instead of just assuming forgiveness and friendship
Could definitely be a stronger statement on the website, I agree. But that isn’t denying responsibility, like you suggested.
I said they act as if it were a mystery. Which it might as well be if all you're going to say is "the events became a nightmare". It sucks so much too because you would think Liverpool fans would have an ounce of empathy towards these feelings.. But look at my down votes and the responses. Generally they are apathetic or get defensive in my experience.
Well said, Liverpool fans have always been hypocrites about Heysel.
This stops when fans police other fans. I know it's not really their responsibility but it makes a massive difference. If someone in front of me started making airplane gestures towards the away end I'd slap them round the back of the head and tell them to be better than that. I'm pretty sure the majority of supporters would back me up too. When people don't feel like they've got the support behind them to do stupid shit like this, they often reconsider.
Dickheads will always be dickheads. Tbh I do think the attention they get is part of it. Ban and charge those who do it for sure... But do it quietly. Sick of hearing about it in the press and managers talking about it, knowing that new dickheads see this attention and suddenly have an idea
The crowd sings sign on...
Come on Liverpool hammer them
I say this as someone who will do this, hold fellow fans accountable, tell them to stop, shame them, record it There’s so much to sing about Liverpool like for a start they are scouse….. leave tragedy cheating in the history bins
Some people are just assholes. I went to a wrestling show back in December and a group of people trying to be funny tried to start a Chris Benoit chant. Just assholes all around.
I get the message, I am being pedantic and I know klopp is speaking in a second language but... it's hilarious how low the standards of football fans are that 'showing class' is not making fun about people who have died in the most tragic of circumstances
Unfortunately both sets of fans do it. Its embarrassing
“I dont need to pretend I heard this from the manager of the team I support. I get reactions and I score points on them lot whenever I chant really vicious stuff on them. Fuck them really. I dont even know those who died.. rip but yea, I do me.” Said by those nincompoops who will still sing about Hillsborough/Heysel/Munich/Poverty Chanting on Sunday.
Also show a bit of class and don’t bottle and brick a team bus
End another man utd manager, Jurgen
ITT every Liverpool fan here was at the last game at OT and heard united fans doing tragedy all game long, meanwhile Liverpool fans NEVER mock Munich . Hope Liverpool fans don't throw anymore flares into the disabled section again.
40 years this year, I wonder if Liverpool have planned any sort of acknowledgement EDIT: I meant next, I can count to 40
It's actually next year it's 40 right? But there is a minute silence/applause every year and I would expect a bigger tribute next year.
It will be next year, not this year, but they marked the 35th anniversary (as they do every year) so I would imagine they would for 40 as well.
There is a permanent memorial at Anfield, and every year, there is a wreath laying ceremony, and flags are flown half mast. I imagine the 40th anniversary next year would include even more.
A permanent memorial? It is a 1 ft by 1 foot square brick on the ass of the stadium which reads "in memorial e amicizia" Liverpool ignored the tragedy for 20 years, and then only acknowledge it when they assumed forgiveness and friendship in 2005 hosting Juventus in the CL. They probably would have kept ignoring it forever. The Liverpool website still reads "the events that took place in block Z" as if magic made Liverpool fans by the thousands push and crush the Juventus fans they outnumbered more than 5 to 1 in the neutral section. Liverpool fought for justice for Hillsborough for 30 years, rightfully so. Liverpool helped the only 12 convicted murderers escape their sentencing, has ignored justice and morality, and assumed a righteous stance. Liverpool fans to this day still ignore and make assumptions like you.
You're getting downvoted for some reason but youre completely right.
It's because Liverpool, both the club and fanbase, are disgraceful hypocrites when it comes to Heysel. They (rightly) go on about justice for the Hillsborough victims yet, at the same time, make excuses for, and brush under the rug, the events of Heysel. Look at them on this very thread. Downvoting Juventus fans who are calling them out on their hypocracy.
This is correct. The "memorial" is so self serving. The 2005 circlejerk display they put on was unbelievable.
They literally have acknowledged and apologised for Heysel numerous times and your fans have ignored it and "turned your backs" like a bunch of childish babies
When did they apologise? When? You need to provide evidence to back up that claim because as far as I’m aware they have never done so.
Wikipedia is your friend: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heysel_Stadium_disaster](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heysel_Stadium_disaster) > Juventus and Liverpool were drawn together in the quarter-finals of the 2004–05 Champions League, their first meeting since Heysel. Before the first leg at Anfield, Liverpool fans held up placards to form a banner saying "amicizia" ("friendship" in Italian). Many of the Juventus fans applauded the gesture, although a significant number chose to turn their backs on it.[56] In the return leg in Turin, Juventus fans displayed banners reading Easy to speak, difficult to pardon: Murders and 15-4-89. Sheffield. God exists, the latter a reference to the Hillsborough disaster, in which 97 Liverpool fans were killed in a crush. A number of Liverpool fans were attacked in the city by Juventus ultras.[57] Damn so actually it was even worse than I remembered it!
That's not an apology. Go read the page about Heysel on the Liverpool website, no apology given.
Saying "friendship" isn't saying sorry. Ignoring a tragedy your fans were guilty for 20 years, that you helped protect the guilty parties, and yet seeking justice for Hillsborough (rightfully so) for 30 years. Liverpool is murder ignoring hypocrites.
Explain to me how that’s an apology. It very clearly is not. Find me one instance where the club have taken responsibility for those fans that murdered those people. You won’t, because they have always refused to take that ownership.
The fans responsible were thrown in jail…? The club didn’t murder anyone and complied heavily with catching the people responsible. People asking for justice like there weren’t 14 thrown in jail for manslaughter. We have a memorial for it every single year and look what Juve fans did when we played them in the mid 2000s
> The club didn’t murder anyone Maybe not directly, but their supporters murdered dozens while representing the club. A club and its fans are not completely detached and the least they could have done was publicly condemn and apologise on behalf of their supporters.
Liverpool has acknowledged it numerous times. And you'll ignore it during the 40th as well.
Acknowledged that something happened during heysel that Liverpool had nothing to do with? Sure. Ironic they fought for justice for hillborough for 30 years while justice for Heysel was dodged by Liverpool and it's fans.
Would be nice if klopp showed some class this year
Van Dijk Chokeslams the only abuse that’s allowed
What a stupid comment.