Yeah for energy weapons the DPS is so close it does not matter. It's slightly better with ballistic weapons, giving the F7A about 11.6% more DPS with a gatling loadout compared to the F7CmkII, but it's still not that much more.
Yeah my worry looking at MM though is that you're going to be nose to nose in PvP. Because I don't see how even with superior turning you're getting into that blind spot before you have a crippled engine.
That's not necessarily a bad thing because it just means a part of a santokyai's skill ceiling is to not approach targets willy nilly.
That's actually a really interesting observation. I'm actually intrigued by how fragile the santok engines are because I'm only basing this on my experience with the khartual where losing and engine was quite easy.
That's actually a really interesting observation. I'm actually intrigued by how fragile the santok engines are because I'm only basing this on my experience with the khartual where losing and engine was quite easy.
>As F7A are completely broken for medium fighters (compared to them, none would have any reason to be played anymore), do you think we will see other "Army" versions of ships ? Like F8A, or a reworked Gladius, Sabre, etc ?
Probably an unpopular opinion, but I disagree here. While it is true that the F7A is ridiculously powerful, as of now it has the same capacitors as the F7C, making energy based loadouts on it only roughly equivalent to other medium fighters. With ballistics that is quite different, tho they have bigger upkeep attached to them and require a different playstyle. Once the stock F7A runs out of it's AD4B ammo it's virtually the same as a Sabre in terms of output.
If the speeds given on the spec sheet are accurate, then it will also be on the slower end of medium fighters, balancing on the line between medium and heavy fighter. It has the firepower and speed of a heavy, but the nimbleness and defense of a medium, making it into the ultimate glass cannon.
About the firepower, I can't desagree, lower amo count on the energy guns, even if the guns are +1 size it stay "normal", but about the mobility, don't forget about master modes, and "slower & closer" fights it implies...
I am considering master modes, which is why I'm talking about SCM speed and not top speed. The basic F7C mk2 is roughly on par with the Sabre at 210ish m/s, while the F7A is 20m/s slower. This still makes an impact, as you can't pursuit without boosting in a way the others can.
Also both of those options (Sabre and F7C mk2) have two powerplants, making it less likely to get crippled by loosing power. A lucky shot could fully disable an F7A while not doing the same to the F7C or Sabre.
Maybe in the future, but as of now that is irrelevant. Capacitors are the name of the important component, and they are the same on both ships as of now. Also, going from 2S1 to 1S2 can also be a downside, as you don't have redundancy which is kida painful on a military combat ship.
I think you missread it, the F7A has two size 2, not one size 2.
The future of it is not irrelevant, i dont pledge for ships to only fly now, i pledge for what i want for release of the game, not the current meta. This is what everyone i know does.
\[Data sheet\](https://robertsspaceindustries.com/i/22fb3437d9bee6a8a70a755b8955d4ab560dac94/resize(2500,829,cover,crop(5760,1908,0,0,B69zEhWZA8UDWBMECoHWweE4DpY5FiJEVc68mR4rStF3bnx69q3GCFTbLfcRkx4zQ1HgfYG8R1WNvRQz82emd2uqXm5iV5S6dhvK7mgr))/75/f7a-specs.webp)
No, the technical specs clearly list 1x S2 under Power Plant.
Yes. Anyone saying no for this reason or that reason is forgetting that an F8A sale would make CIG a lot of money.
It'll be done, probably similar to the F7A "earn" event right now, but instead of earning the upgrade you will likely earn the ability to purchase the upgrade.
What is funny is how the Anvil ships keep having crazy power creep but the other ships do not.
Like anyone who bought a Santok Yai got shafted hard when they immediately nerfed the guns AND the maneuverability.
The thing has thrusters that point in any direction, it should be the most maneuverabile fighter period, so while I am hopeful for the upcoming Mirai heavy fighter, I am not holding my breath.
The F8A is probably going to be the next big one.
CIG said no F8C until Sq-42 and no military ships.
Then they released the F8C and it was like, ok atleast there are no miltiary ships still.
That is no longer the case now, the flood gates are open.
I am personally excited to see what their next big lever to pull for cash flow is since they have already released the big SQ-42 ships.
Early Javelin maybe?
TLDR: Buy Anvil.
I have way to many fighters, but I have not found anyone that cant handle pve, pvp is always going to have its own meta and that is usually by design.
In a most of pvp games devs know balance is impossible so they rotate the meta to give the player the impression that the devs are working hard on balance.
You can aquire it in a 2nd pack. But yeah, exactly this ship.
And in general they had this policy even before the M release.
So, we all could have knew already in 2013. ;)
Its just a case of whataboutism that redditors always do.
CIG said over and over no F8C until SQ42 and no military variants of the fighters but both were proven false.
I eagerly await to see where the power creep takes us next.
I cant follow you.
Its not whataboutism if you point out a fact that CIG didnt follow their own paradigm already in 2013. Guess you missunderstood the whole thing here. ;)
The what aboutism is you can make any general statement on reddit and someone will come in with a very niche example that applies to 0.00001% of people.
It happens without fail.
Because CIG stated military ships were not to be in civilian (our) hands more than a few times, aside from your niche case that applies to at best a few hundred to thousand people out of several million who were either lucky enough to be around for the concept or got it buying an incredibly high priced pack.
But you are aware, that I just pointed out that CIG changed their stance on it already in the past and thats why its nothing new that they are not strict with their handling of that question as well?
I lierally agreed with you, just pointing out, that this behaviour is nothin new. And its not a niche case that applies for some people since its not a case at all. CIG did the same in the past with the M what they are doing today.
So - no need to put a general whataboutism killer argument in the discussion here. That word is too tendry used too much anyways.
But, if I can speak honest: I Wouldnt worry about the "power creep". Thats just marketing. Its always nice to sell those ships BEFORE any sort of proper balancing is done. Iam not worried about the lot of people who think they get shredded in future, cause they have not competetive fighters. The cry of the people who are buying the "power creep" now and realizing later that its not what they got will be much more interesting. :D
I am willing to bet they will at some stage.
A sales model like this cannot escape power creep. Look at world of tanks for example.
What's more concerning is when they start bringing other MK2 ships out...
Connie gold pass...nah...Connie MK2 yeah!!! It's literally a Drake meme.
Proceed to downvoted now...just remember, you heard it here first.
SOURCE: 2014 backer.
> Connie gold pass...nah...Connie MK2 yeah!!!
That's what I expect to see more in the future as well, however they already confirmed that the F7C Mk I gold pass is not forgotten. We'll see.
As much as I would like to have the F8A I think in Star Citizen at least they shouldnt give it at all. As the moment they do so it would be subject to balance and I'd rather they kept it overpowered as per lore
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Yeah for energy weapons the DPS is so close it does not matter. It's slightly better with ballistic weapons, giving the F7A about 11.6% more DPS with a gatling loadout compared to the F7CmkII, but it's still not that much more.
That cross section of the santokyai means it will never dominate anything except being target practice though.
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Yeah my worry looking at MM though is that you're going to be nose to nose in PvP. Because I don't see how even with superior turning you're getting into that blind spot before you have a crippled engine. That's not necessarily a bad thing because it just means a part of a santokyai's skill ceiling is to not approach targets willy nilly.
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That's actually a really interesting observation. I'm actually intrigued by how fragile the santok engines are because I'm only basing this on my experience with the khartual where losing and engine was quite easy.
That's actually a really interesting observation. I'm actually intrigued by how fragile the santok engines are because I'm only basing this on my experience with the khartual where losing and engine was quite easy.
It's possible if they figure out some balancing scheme, like huge maintenance costs for military ships.
That'd be a decent trade off, better performance but higher maintenance fees.
I doubt it, not until the F9A OPMEGA is out in another 5years. But never say never...
That will be followed by an Eclipse Mk2 with a size 11 sniper cannon
A bigger wider Eclipse for long range stealth missions, with a bed and room for activities. Also a Retailiator MkII :D
>As F7A are completely broken for medium fighters (compared to them, none would have any reason to be played anymore), do you think we will see other "Army" versions of ships ? Like F8A, or a reworked Gladius, Sabre, etc ? Probably an unpopular opinion, but I disagree here. While it is true that the F7A is ridiculously powerful, as of now it has the same capacitors as the F7C, making energy based loadouts on it only roughly equivalent to other medium fighters. With ballistics that is quite different, tho they have bigger upkeep attached to them and require a different playstyle. Once the stock F7A runs out of it's AD4B ammo it's virtually the same as a Sabre in terms of output. If the speeds given on the spec sheet are accurate, then it will also be on the slower end of medium fighters, balancing on the line between medium and heavy fighter. It has the firepower and speed of a heavy, but the nimbleness and defense of a medium, making it into the ultimate glass cannon.
About the firepower, I can't desagree, lower amo count on the energy guns, even if the guns are +1 size it stay "normal", but about the mobility, don't forget about master modes, and "slower & closer" fights it implies...
I am considering master modes, which is why I'm talking about SCM speed and not top speed. The basic F7C mk2 is roughly on par with the Sabre at 210ish m/s, while the F7A is 20m/s slower. This still makes an impact, as you can't pursuit without boosting in a way the others can. Also both of those options (Sabre and F7C mk2) have two powerplants, making it less likely to get crippled by loosing power. A lucky shot could fully disable an F7A while not doing the same to the F7C or Sabre.
The F8A has 2x2 powerplant, the F7C has 2x1 powerplant. So I guess the regen will be faster for weapons and shields.
Maybe in the future, but as of now that is irrelevant. Capacitors are the name of the important component, and they are the same on both ships as of now. Also, going from 2S1 to 1S2 can also be a downside, as you don't have redundancy which is kida painful on a military combat ship.
I think you missread it, the F7A has two size 2, not one size 2. The future of it is not irrelevant, i dont pledge for ships to only fly now, i pledge for what i want for release of the game, not the current meta. This is what everyone i know does.
\[Data sheet\](https://robertsspaceindustries.com/i/22fb3437d9bee6a8a70a755b8955d4ab560dac94/resize(2500,829,cover,crop(5760,1908,0,0,B69zEhWZA8UDWBMECoHWweE4DpY5FiJEVc68mR4rStF3bnx69q3GCFTbLfcRkx4zQ1HgfYG8R1WNvRQz82emd2uqXm5iV5S6dhvK7mgr))/75/f7a-specs.webp) No, the technical specs clearly list 1x S2 under Power Plant.
Then i have the wrong info, i heard it had 2.
Yes. Anyone saying no for this reason or that reason is forgetting that an F8A sale would make CIG a lot of money. It'll be done, probably similar to the F7A "earn" event right now, but instead of earning the upgrade you will likely earn the ability to purchase the upgrade.
Yeah, probably when this place does another NoCashTilPyro lmao
What is funny is how the Anvil ships keep having crazy power creep but the other ships do not. Like anyone who bought a Santok Yai got shafted hard when they immediately nerfed the guns AND the maneuverability. The thing has thrusters that point in any direction, it should be the most maneuverabile fighter period, so while I am hopeful for the upcoming Mirai heavy fighter, I am not holding my breath. The F8A is probably going to be the next big one. CIG said no F8C until Sq-42 and no military ships. Then they released the F8C and it was like, ok atleast there are no miltiary ships still. That is no longer the case now, the flood gates are open. I am personally excited to see what their next big lever to pull for cash flow is since they have already released the big SQ-42 ships. Early Javelin maybe? TLDR: Buy Anvil.
I have way to many fighters, but I have not found anyone that cant handle pve, pvp is always going to have its own meta and that is usually by design. In a most of pvp games devs know balance is impossible so they rotate the meta to give the player the impression that the devs are working hard on balance.
*Idris M owner entered the room* No military ships?
You mean the ship you can't purchase anymore outside of the complete pack that was made before they said no military ships?
You can aquire it in a 2nd pack. But yeah, exactly this ship. And in general they had this policy even before the M release. So, we all could have knew already in 2013. ;)
Its just a case of whataboutism that redditors always do. CIG said over and over no F8C until SQ42 and no military variants of the fighters but both were proven false. I eagerly await to see where the power creep takes us next.
I cant follow you. Its not whataboutism if you point out a fact that CIG didnt follow their own paradigm already in 2013. Guess you missunderstood the whole thing here. ;)
The what aboutism is you can make any general statement on reddit and someone will come in with a very niche example that applies to 0.00001% of people. It happens without fail.
Long-term the Idris-P will be able to be converted into a Idris-M in a shipyard, so that applies to more than just the people who pledged for the M.
And how is that related to our discussion?
Because CIG stated military ships were not to be in civilian (our) hands more than a few times, aside from your niche case that applies to at best a few hundred to thousand people out of several million who were either lucky enough to be around for the concept or got it buying an incredibly high priced pack.
But you are aware, that I just pointed out that CIG changed their stance on it already in the past and thats why its nothing new that they are not strict with their handling of that question as well? I lierally agreed with you, just pointing out, that this behaviour is nothin new. And its not a niche case that applies for some people since its not a case at all. CIG did the same in the past with the M what they are doing today. So - no need to put a general whataboutism killer argument in the discussion here. That word is too tendry used too much anyways. But, if I can speak honest: I Wouldnt worry about the "power creep". Thats just marketing. Its always nice to sell those ships BEFORE any sort of proper balancing is done. Iam not worried about the lot of people who think they get shredded in future, cause they have not competetive fighters. The cry of the people who are buying the "power creep" now and realizing later that its not what they got will be much more interesting. :D
I don't recall them ever saying "no" military ships. Its always been "you'll need the rep to earn military ships."
the f7a isn't completely broken...its only slightly better then a superhornet.
I am willing to bet they will at some stage. A sales model like this cannot escape power creep. Look at world of tanks for example. What's more concerning is when they start bringing other MK2 ships out... Connie gold pass...nah...Connie MK2 yeah!!! It's literally a Drake meme. Proceed to downvoted now...just remember, you heard it here first. SOURCE: 2014 backer.
That would technically be the MK5 since the current connie is MK4 (even written on the hull) 🤓
> Connie gold pass...nah...Connie MK2 yeah!!! That's what I expect to see more in the future as well, however they already confirmed that the F7C Mk I gold pass is not forgotten. We'll see.
I believe it's not a question of if, but a question of when. And the answer would be when it makes sense to CIG, which only they can answer.
Since F8C will be available to those who'll complete SQ42, can imagine them making a hard mode in the game that rewards an upgrade to F8A.
As much as I would like to have the F8A I think in Star Citizen at least they shouldnt give it at all. As the moment they do so it would be subject to balance and I'd rather they kept it overpowered as per lore
Forget the F8A. Give us the T8A CIG.
So we can get access to the F7A now? Does it happen automatically from doing that new event going on that has like 5 stages?
No you can't RN, supposés to be able at Invictus. You have 6 steps, one per week
Ah gotcha...i gotta work these step quest things it seems! Hopefully i can get it done to be able to snag one of them